Forum:New Chat Moderators Problem

As you have all seen, our admin, DP added 4 new chat moderators. Claudia, Nada, Tucky and Evan. He gave them the chat mod rights basing himself on the rule "The first 4 people who comment on one of my blogs will become a chat mod". I find it pretty hard-to-take, not only because of his reasoning, also because of the sheer amount of new chat moderators and the method he has chosen them by.

The reason for this forum is the discussion and I suggest democraticaly voting for the rights of the 4 new chat moderators.

By voting I mean that the users that have the possibility to vote and the ones that regularily come to the chat and know how things work there should vote for the addition of the new chat moderators.

I do not agree to all of the new additions and I know that other do not as well so that is why I ask for everyone's opinion on a vote to KEEP or DEMOD the new chat moderators.

I also suggest a new chat moderator, one that deserves it. User:Pandawarrior has even asked DP before for this certain right, but was turned down and I see it unfair for her, being the one worthy to become a chat moderator to not really become one!

We should not leave the decision for the existance of these 4 new chat moderators to only one man. Though he might be an admin, our favorite hater's way is the right way. DEMOCRACY. This wiki is everyones, but the chat is ours, it belongs to the users and you as users who edit here and talk on this chat deserve to decide this!

Do you wish to vote to make the position of the new chat moderators permanent or not?

I will add to the vote people who are suggested by at least 2 users(not including themselves).

FYI the wiki is not a full democracy. -- 14:50, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * FYI it is. 14:54, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Tuckyd's Proposition
Why not we keep the mods for now for 3 days or so and see how it works out. I think it will give the 4 of us a fair chance. 08:35, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Everyone keeps track pf their time on chat Over the weekend keep an hours sheet starting now.

{C}The thing is that we aren't just questioning the capability of the chatmods, but also the rashness of DP's decision. I could agree that some of you are capable, but that is the use of the poll that will be made, we don't need a 3 day trial...What do you want to do? Ban a spammer? The trial won't clarify anything...

Ahem tucky if we go by this proposition might as well add my name in there since I'm like from 12 utc till 2 am sunday with some minnors interruptions on saturdays sometimes! If we are trully gonna see how much time we spend might as well do the hole week!

Pandawarrior
Should she become a chat mod

Yes
 * 1) -- 09:02, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 16:28, February 26, 2012 (UTC)

No

Calu
Should she stay a chat mod

Yes
 * 1) -- 09:02, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

No
 * 1) Troll King Imhungry4444 14:51, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Discussion
HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM LPK said himself he wont be visiting the Wikia that much anymroe and Ryu and DP dont come to the chat that often. Plus, we need an odd number for the number of chat mods so things dont turn into a stalemate. I dont think its about who would make a good chat mod but who is on the chat often enough to moderate it. I for one go on the chat 5-6 times a day. im not saying i should be considered but thats just a good example. i think i should be considered as a back up if things dont work out if someone is stripped of their status or something like that. But all in all, i say either Panda or MJ. Troll King Imhungry4444 19:03, February 24, 2012 (UTC) No MJ. Panda or MDM. SeaTerror 19:05, February 24, 2012 (UTC)

I am against some choices,as i think they were quite misjudged.I know a lot of people that spend more time on chat,and are more active than the 4 new MODs that dont have MOD status.I think that Should change.For the time being i will not state who i want to change.If the desicion to change them is made,then i will openly vote.As for the fact that Panda isnt a MOD,i think she deserves it,and should have that star beside her name.

I vote Panda. Because she's awesome. It&#39;s KOROMO! 19:08, February 24, 2012 (UTC)

No offence to the new MODs but if I had knew that Panda requested MOD status in past, I would have made her my First and maybe only nominee. Experience, edits, age, maturity, sexy body and understanding .. SHE GOT IT ALL !!! PANDA !! PANDA !! PANDA !!

Its not like I am saying that the new MODs don't deserve the the MOD status BUT PANDA DESERVES IT MOST !!

-- 19:11, February 24, 2012 (UTC)


 * Are you sayin i dont deserve it cause i dont have a sexy body? i beg to differ Troll King Imhungry4444 19:19, February 24, 2012 (UTC)

I don't like to complain, but the way this was decided seems idiotic. First four people? That is ridiculous. I would love to hear the reasoning behind that. I am not gonna make any recommendations, but this is not the way things are done around here, at least in my experience. 19:16, February 24, 2012 (UTC)

Even though I am a mod now, I agree with this. I always felt that Panda should had become a Mod instead of all of us. She would actually be a great mod, and she is helpful. If possible it would be great if we made her made her a mod, and possibly either keep one or vote for another mod (removing all the new 4 mods, including me). I am actually grateful that I became a mod, since most of the time there are a lot of spammers when I'm on and there is no mod. But if this is what we have to do, I won't argue against it.

I feel thAt This issue was brought up either because people are jealous or mad at the process. I will stand by the mod selections because would the four of us be mods if DP didnt want us to be. When ryu was made a mod novody gave a crap. If you have a problem with me or any of the mods tell me what.-- 20:58, February 24, 2012 (UTC)

Saying this is because of jelousy is stupid. I believe that one's opinion is not enough to decide such a large-scale decision. That's why it should be fair enough that all the people from the chat should have a word in this. And a vote is the best decision to decide who is actually worth of becoming a chat mod. Since Shiv deserves this right way more than you, but she is not one of THE 4 new chat mods. It is not a fair decision and the people of the chat know who deserves to be a chat moderator and who doesn't. You know you aren't worthy right Tucky, I guess that is the reason why you are directly accusing me of jealousy, fear and don't accept this thing happening. I don't see any problem with democracy. It's the fairest way. I'll make sure that everyone that usually comes to the chat will vote. People are not stupid enough Tucky to not know who is good enough and who is not.

I disgress with my proposition for Mod, my sense of justice is mostly decided by my mood and I can only acess the chat while on weekends meaning I would only be fit for such task on weekends and holidays assuming everything thing is alright with my psych. I also agree with Claudia altough not fully! Her position has mod should be maintained while the other 3 are desnecessary. As I suported before Pandawarrior should be a Mod! Her reason are already listed and I think they somewhat aply to Claudia too! Having in mind only some admins and Ryu live in timezones out of Europe and these mentioned before seem to not enter the chat has often has it would be ideal I support a new Mod from the other side of the atlantic as long as a new european mod, Panda and Claudia are fitting for this jobs altough if they do not wish to do them we cannot imply such responsibility on their shoulders! Also my judgement towars Claudia or any other user was in no way afected by feelings I am only speeking in a way to improve the chat, no feelings interfering

k time for some serious talk, I may get offensive but please don't take personally cause this is for wiki's good.

@ IH, Sexy body got nothing to do with this >_>

@ P15, I totally agree with you and I am sure that this is temporary cause if this goes on then there will issues arise that will surpass our understanding. I hope DP thinks this threw one more time cause its not late. If the new mods were given the title threw sheer luck then it can be taken away with same stuff.

@ Tuck, don't use the word "jealous" so easily. All 4 of you were chosen by sheer luck of who comments first. DP didn't judged your edits or your qualifications cause if he did then there are people on this wikia who have far more greater qualifications then many of you. SO please don't go labeling this as jealousy making making the discussion worst.

I think having a vote will be best solution to this.

-- 21:27, February 24, 2012 (UTC)

What MJ mentioned inspired me for an idea.What do you say we have/find say 2 mods for each timezone?And no,i dont mean for EACH one.i mean that we shouldnt have Mods that are only active from xAM to aPM,when many people sleep on xAM and wake up later.(plus life).So here's what i say:We have two Mods from America (North or South,whatever,it counts),two from europe (the max hour difference is from Portugal to Russia,which is 3 hours so ok), two for West Asia(the biggest part of the continent),as well as two for East Asia(covers Australia kinda too,and Philipiness).So i think we have a world scale "clock".Ofc it is logical that those would meet,but hey,just cause they are mods doesnt mean they dont wanna chat right?Sorry if this idea sounds somewhat racistic,it isnt.I think it's more practical this way to solve the timeline problem.Especially more practical than what we had till 2 months ago,with only Rici and LPK as Mods,who both have the same timeline

Okay, I never bothered with DP deciding alone on who becomes a chatmod. Mainly because the chat doesn't really affect the wiki, and back then it wasn't even guaranteed that the chat will stay. But it appears that over the months, the chat became an established and frequently used function.

Personally I don't think that the chat needs any moderation at all, but I agree that voting on the chatmods is the way to go. It is just the way thiings go on the wikia system. 21:39, February 24, 2012 (UTC)

No onw is answering my question. What do you guys have against the 4 new chat mods. Tuckyd

I just want to say my take on this. I propposed some rules on DP's talk page here. As a mod, if I stick as one, I will only ban if a user continually breaks these rules. I don't quite care if I stay mod or not, Panda deserves it FAR more than me. But I am just telling you, if I stay mod, I will not abuse my power. If I do, feel free to report me and/or demote me. 21:52, February 24, 2012 (UTC)

Exact same feeling as Nada.- tuckyd

We already told you what the problem was many times. You yourself will just abuse your power such as when you wanted to ban me and NWW or just saying the word doom. SeaTerror 00:13, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

St 1. You were provoking me 2. Those were empty threats-- 00:24, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Even if they were empty threats, you might still kick and ban ST out since you are a mod. Evanalmighty 00:28, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Agree with Evan, you were really acting power-mad. Plus, the reason that you were using to give those threats were not even valid. Baseless threats are worst then empty. -- 01:39, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Let's look at the issue practically - why do we need new chat moderators? Because there isn't enough on chat. This is fair enough. But how the new moderators were chosen was quite rash, 'The first four to comment...' means there is a high chance these four new moderators will be users who are on at the same time. Hence the problem goes unsolved.

I know from experience that between the times of 5.00pm -> 11.00pm (UTC+10:00) that there is almost never a moderator online. Including myself, the only other users who are on frequently around this time are SeaTerror, Straw Hat Boy and Evan (nearing the end of that time period.) So that is a 6 hour period where chat goes unmonitored - and there has been several times where new users or spam users have chosen to come on.

The point I'm trying to make is, take some time when choosing new moderators. Look at when they are online most often, and choose four whose timezones overlap so chat gets a good coverage of monitoring - rather then allowing the spam users a quarter of the day to wreck havoc. KuroAshi98 00:55, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

@Kuro: I'm on the computer 90% of the day. I could keep the chat open at all times and check every 5 minutes or so for vandalists. Still voting for Panda, though. 00:58, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Scratch that. 01:13, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I vote for nothing, this is basically everyone kissing Panda's ass. The Goddess of The wiki. All hail to her, Why do we need new mods, the people nominated all except for Calua aren't going to solve the problem. It's easy being a chat mod, it takes something special to become a good mod, I do nominate MDM as president of The Panda ass kissing commitee. The problems not going to get solved i gurantee it. I would nominate myself but my life is getting busier and im the Akainu type of authority. People open your eyes!!! our "leader" picks mods based on chat comments. Seems like the problem starts at the top. People when theres blood on the streets buy property. Thats what i intend on doing.

It seems to me that the four chat mods have slight overlap. Evan is Asian, Nada is idk what. Calua is generally on later than me (US schedule) and I am on earliear in the weekdays. Rici and LPK and Ryu are mostly on when I am at school. On the weekends, though, I am often on quite a bit except when I travel. Like last weekend. I also come here very early in the morinings around 12:00 UTC 01:18, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

You may think there's an overlap Tuckyd but that doesn't change the situation where I come home everyday to find chat empty of any of the nominated moderators for six hours at a minimum. I was being generous with that time period, sometimes it isn't until 1am (for me) that someone actually shows up. I can understand that there'll be times when a moderator simply cannot be on, but a gap in time like that is just unreasonable if we are serious about solving the issue at hand. KuroAshi98 01:35, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I cant help you unless you tell me the time.... 02:25, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Because you are hardly on anyway. The only reason you have been on more is because you became a chat mod. SeaTerror 03:06, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

And guess what Imma stay coming more. 03:09, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Why? You only wanted the power because of your whole "compassion" speech. You don't actually give a shit about the chat since you were hardly there in the first place. By your "compassion" rules then if somebody like Hungry trolls you would ban them right away. SeaTerror 03:39, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I wouldn't ban them right away I would warn them and if they continued longer I would ban them, and btw Zoro-san suggested that we just have 8 mods the 7 current ones + panda. 06:04, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

EXACTLY why you would make a shitty mod. SeaTerror 06:07, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Why am I a shitty mod? Do you have a grudge against me from your possible ban? 06:12, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

"Possible ban" my ass, that as clear power-madness. Stop saying as that false-allegation you were putting on ST were right. THEY WERE WRONG AND DP AND EVERYBODY ON WIKI AGREED WITH ME. You apologized and now you are going all might over that issue again. Seriously Tuck, you lost even the last drop the respect I had for you since you were a blogger and good friend. Sorry but this time the mess you made is too much to ignore. -- 06:18, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I am very confused. What mess have I made. ST keeps screaming at me. I'm decided to give up on this issue unless someone insulted me. ST insulted me so I came back to defend myself. Will I make empty threats again- NO. Will you understand me??????? I don't know MDM. -- 06:25, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

For 3 hours i didnt touch this forum until i saw ST's comment above. I didnt want to have this discussion MDM 06:27, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I actually misread it. Either way with your new addition it would still be bad. Trolling is trolling. There is nothing wrong with it. You proved you don't like people to have fun in the chat. SeaTerror 06:29, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

ST I will apologize again for last night. Ok. I was here earlier and I let everything slide when and didnt make a single fuss about it. Can we just end this topic. 06:31, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Why would we let it end? SeaTerror 06:37, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

No comment. 06:40, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Ok, I will be neutral and request that both parties end the argument. Do you all have to just argue over such a trival matter? If you want Tucky to be stripped of his post, just go and complain to DP! There is really no need to argue in such an important forum. Evanalmighty 06:43, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Two cents aren't enough. Here's my 2 dollars and 10 cents! While I agree Panda, M.D.M, and MJ deserve this much more and I could definately repsect their autority more then our current set, I wouldn't dare strip a man of his current modding position. When I became a mod, I was so excited. I had formally requested what I felt I had earned. I posted the news to my facebook! I loved the congratulations my fellow users game me. If someone took that away from me the next day, I'd be heart broken. And if this position doesn't mean that much to you, maybe you don't deserve it. 06:55, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Well, this is DP's chance to break Ryu's heart. Haven't you always wanted to do that, DP?

And Panda, MDM, and MJ do deserve it. 07:05, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Lol Ryu *i support Ryu's statement* 07:08, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

No MJ. SeaTerror 07:11, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Oh, so if anyone get's cut, it's not one of the four randomly selected users who people created this forum to complain about. No, it's the guy who summoned the courage to ask his rival for the position. The guy who made a list of reasons why he earned the right to be called "Moderator". The guy who got the entire chat to root him on. The guys who's already had modding expirence. I see how it is... the new guys are desperate to keep their positions, so why not cut Ryu? You disgust me in a very attractive way. 07:20, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I think you misread something somewhere. SeaTerror 07:25, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

...I can't tell if serious, Ryu...That was just a joke. You're a great mod. You don't deserve to be cut.

Us four (me, Tucky, Even, Calu) never deserved this status, in my opinion. You, LPK, and Rici worked for it. You are mature and trustworthy enough for it. We are not. 07:26, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Yeah i mentioned your name in reference to that no one objected dto your promotion. 07:27, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I see that nothing very special has been discussed and in the end, a poll is the best solution for this.

Vote part 1
First to be voted are the newly chosen chat moderators.

You need at least 300 edits and 3 months of activity on this wiki to vote.

''Voting stopped, the results are clear and the only one with more "yes" stepped down, now we will proceed to the formal vote. '''

If there are more votes for "yes" than "no", then the respective person will keep his/her rights.

User:Tuckyd
Do you agree that this user should have chat moderator rights?

Yes I do. No I don't
 * 1) ​ 12:57, February 25, 2012 (UTC) (hipster yes vote)
 * 2) -- 14:45, February 25, 2012 (UTC) hey you can vote for yourself right
 * 1)   X-RAPTOR    Talk   09:49, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 09:50, February 25, 2012 (UTC) He/she can be nominated again in the formal vote.
 * 09:53, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1)   Blackened D. Soul    Talk   12:17, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 12:21, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1) (sorry, don't have anything against you, but there needs to be a democratic decision)
 * 13:05, February 25, 2012 (UTC) You need to prove a bit more to become a chat mod.
 * 1) Evanalmighty 13:11, February 25, 2012 (UTC) Sorry Tucky, I have nothing against you. However, since you attempted to abuse your power, I had second thoughts.
 * 2)   14:43, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 3)  Troll King Imhungry4444 14:51, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 4)   18:07, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 5)   19:48, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 6) SeaTerror 19:50, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 19:58, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1) Hell no you shouldn't be mod.
 * 2) Sergant Alpha 20:28, February 25, 2012 (UTC) This was already official by the time X voted.
 * 21:32, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1) Hell no you shouldn't be mod.
 * 2) Sergant Alpha 20:28, February 25, 2012 (UTC) This was already official by the time X voted.
 * 21:32, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Evan how is what I did considered abuse of power. He was repeatedly swearing, insulting and provoking me. He even asked for the kick ban. I didn't even do it and I wasn't going todo it. -- 14:39, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

User:Claudia323
Do you agree that this user should have chat moderator rights?

Yes I do.
 * 1)   Blackened D. Soul    Talk   12:17, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 13:05, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1) Evanalmighty 13:09, February 25, 2012 (UTC) (Fainted upon signing)
 * 2) -- 14:44, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 3)  19:36, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 4) -- 20:08, February 25, 2012 (UTC) (I am trusting her just like how I trusted Ryu, I am hoping for better future)
 * 5) Sergant Alpha 20:18, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 6)  21:30, February 25, 2012 (UTC) (she's more responsible of the four)
 * 7) FoolishMortalFOOL 23:26, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1) Sergant Alpha 20:18, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 2)  21:30, February 25, 2012 (UTC) (she's more responsible of the four)
 * 3) FoolishMortalFOOL 23:26, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

No I don't
 * 09:51, February 25, 2012 (UTC) He/she can be nominated again in the formal vote.
 * 1)   X-RAPTOR    Talk   09:53, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 12:22, February 25, 2012 (UTC) (I just simply don't think we need more mods, that's all.)
 * 1) (sorry, don't have anything against you, but there needs to be a democratic decision)
 * 12:57, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1)   14:45, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 2)  Troll King Imhungry4444 14:51, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 3)   You are a great user, and you have potential i just don't your right to be chat mod right now, maybe in the future
 * 4)   19:48, February 25, 2012 (UTC) sorry calu but its a no for me
 * 5) SeaTerror 19:50, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 6) Dmurray1031 22:44, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

User:Uknownada
Do you agree that this user should have chat moderator rights?

Yes I do. No I don't
 * 1)   X-RAPTOR    Talk   09:49, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 09:51, February 25, 2012 (UTC) He/she can be nominated again in the formal vote.
 * 09:53, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1)   Blackened D. Soul    Talk   12:18, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 12:22, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1) (sorry, don't have anything against you, but there needs to be a democratic decision)
 * 12:57, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 13:06, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1) Evanalmighty 13:11, February 25, 2012 (UTC) Not today.
 * 2)   14:45, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 3)  Troll King Imhungry4444 14:51, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 4)   don't think you would do anything.
 * 5) SeaTerror 19:50, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 20:10, February 25, 2012 (UTC) (you are a great great great great friend .. .. I am just not sure about this MOD thing)
 * 1) Sergant Alpha 20:29, February 25, 2012 (UTC) You're hawt and all, but you barely come on chat.
 * 1) Sergant Alpha 20:29, February 25, 2012 (UTC) You're hawt and all, but you barely come on chat.

User:Evanalmighty
Do you agree that this user should have chat moderator rights?

Yes I do. No I don't
 * 1) Evanalmighty 11:48, February 25, 2012 (UTC) Cannot believe I can do it.
 * 2)   Blackened D. Soul    Talk   12:19, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 13:07, February 25, 2012 (UTC) You just need to be more active on chat,the rest I cant find a reason for you to not be a chat mod.
 * 1) -- 14:40, February 25, 2012 (UTC) the more the better in my opinion
 * 19:35, February 25, 2012 (UTC) i wish i had a sig like marimo -_-
 * 20:12, February 25, 2012 (UTC) (Just like Ryu, I think you will make a great MOD in future)
 * 20:12, February 25, 2012 (UTC) (Just like Ryu, I think you will make a great MOD in future)
 * 1)   X-RAPTOR    Talk   09:50, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 09:52, February 25, 2012 (UTC) He/she can be nominated again in the formal vote.
 * 1) Sorry, but you're not that often on the chat
 * 12:23, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1) (sorry, don't have anything against you, but there needs to be a democratic decision)
 * 12:57, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1)   14:46, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 2)  Troll King Imhungry4444 14:51, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 3)   18:07, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 4)   19:48, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 5) SeaTerror 19:50, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 6) Sergant Alpha 20:33, February 25, 2012 (UTC) Don't know you well enough.
 * 21:34, February 25, 2012 (UTC) My opinion on you is like Medic: I HAVE NO IDEA!
 * 1) Sergant Alpha 20:33, February 25, 2012 (UTC) Don't know you well enough.
 * 21:34, February 25, 2012 (UTC) My opinion on you is like Medic: I HAVE NO IDEA!

The proposed chat moderators
Now for the proposed chat moderators which I have heard their names a lot on this forum: User:Monkey.D.Me; User:Marcus Junior and User:Pandawarrior

If you wish to assume the responsibility of being a chat moderator and accept the position in case the vote turns in your favor. Please say it on this forum. I will not start a vote for people who do not want to be chat moderators.

Vote discussion
Please feel free to discuss this vote.

At this rate I think I can raise the white flag already. *Prepares White Flag* Evanalmighty 09:51, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I don't even know Evan or Calu well enough to make a statement. 09:54, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I do accept nomination! Tough new discussion about the old chat mods have risen especially about Ryu, some people do not seem to aknowledge him has worthy of chat mod maybe we could extend the vote pool to the old mods too?

Questionining the old mods as well, fair enough for me. But which people have a problem with Ryu?

I for one do not fully support his position, Neowitch and X-RAPTOR are some too, you were present when they said it. Altough this discussion is not fairly new it was raised first when he did become one.

Just for the formal vote part, I want to nominate Seaterror, Imhungry, Dmurray and Pandawarrior for the position. Sea and Hungry appear to be troublesome at first glance, but they are good people who know the wiki and its users extremely well. As for Panda....well...

http://s14.directupload.net/images/120225/4duajvyl.jpg 10:30, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I think the only one that is worth to become a chatmod is Calu. She is often on the chat, I'm sure she is very responsible, she will make a pretty good balance between strictness and laxness.

On another note I would also advice Panda as a chatmod (If she wants to become one)

As for Nada...I'm completely neutral

Alright, I guess it is my turn to speak on this matter. I didn't want this to turn into a shitstorm, that's why I've kept quiet so far, but now that it has I might as well speak up. First off, I'd like to congratulate the new chatmods, and I'm sorry that your first days in the office were marred with such controversy.

It's true that I asked DP a while back about the possibility of me becoming a chatmod, unfortunately I can't paste my exact request since it happened on the chat. Regardless, I stand by my request.

As for my nominees, Kuro made an interesting comment about timezones and the lack of moderation during a certain time of the day, which shouldn't happen. Simply living in one specific timezone doesn't make one a perfect choice for chatmod, there should be other things taken into consideration, namely: Time spent on the chat; experience (as an editor, and a chatter), self confidence and people skills. The first 2 are obvious, the other can be summarized by: If you don't have the confidence to pull of an unpopular decision (such as temporarily banning a regular), and if you don't have the diplomatic skills to deescalate 99% of arguments before it comes to that, then you are not fit to be a chatmod.

For those reasons, I nominate MJ and Nada for the role of chatmod. I also propose that Evan, should he lose his current position, be one of the first nominees for chatmod, should the need for more arise again, to fill the east asian timezone.

Also, I don't quite understand, is the current poll just a preliminary poll to test the necessity of a formal vote, or is it official? {C} 11:52, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I propose that we remove the new mods for the time being, no matter who it is. Going back to zero and doing a formal vote (with proper nomination) is the way to go.

As for chatmod qualities, the best admins/mods are always those who don't act like one. Sounds contradicting, but administration/moderation should only happen when it is absolutely necessary and unavoidable. Especially the chat is a place where people can talk freely, and I don't want this carefree athmosphere getting disturbed by some overzealous chatmod. This is also the reason why I'm against rules for the chat, general internet etiquette should be enough.

As DP said months ago "don't be a dick and all is fine". 12:13, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

A fairly large forum I used to moderate had these simple rules that cover everything astoundingly well: 1. THIS IS OUR HOUSE 2. THOU SHALL OBSERVE FORUM ETIQUETTE 3. THOU SHALL THINK BEFORE POSTING 4. THOU SHALL CONTRIBUTE TO THE SITE 5. THOU SHALL NOT SPAM 6. THOU SHALL RESPECT FORUM VETERANS 7. ENGLISH IS THE OFFICIAL LANGUAGE 8. THOU SHALL RESPECT YOUR ID 9. READ THE COMMANDMENTS 10. THOU SHALL HAVE FUN 12:20, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I made this vote with the intention of it being final. But Jinbe does have a point. Even though returning it to 0 and then suggesting new chat mods again will lead to more trouble and as you saw, the peace of the chat has been already disturbed and some people are getting depressed or angry about it. Dp suggested that it should go with trial and error and as you could imagine, that would not completely fix the entire problem and many people will still be against some of the new chat mods. That's why a vote was the best solution, but prolonging the vote to first remove the newly-added ones and then propose better new chat mods would take too much time for the peace of the chat to return. The result would be the same, don't you think so Jinbe? I hope that by tomorrow I can start the 2nd vote for the proposed chat mods, MDM, MJ and Shiv, since MJ and Shiv accepted to be voted for, what remains now is MDM. So I believe that we should stick to these 2 votes and make their reults official.

Opposite is the case, going back to zero is the only way to achieve a fair result. Any of the 4 who stays chatmod doesn't have to compete with other potential nominees, thats why it is unfair. Also, we need a few more days to sort this, the nominees should at least get to know of their nomination. 12:42, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Understandable enough, so should the amount of time for voting be lessened?

What is the deadline anyway? 13:11, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Heard that the deadline is after 2 weeks. Evanalmighty 13:12, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Actually, the vote itself is horrible. No matter how you look at it, the question shouldn't have been if the individual users should stay, but wether we re-roll the nomination or not. As I said, the 4 above only had to compete with each other, not with potential other nominees.

Example:

Imagine Evan (or Claudi, or Tucky or whoever) is the only one who remians a chatmod through this vote. But there is still the need for 3 other mods so we hold a proper nomination/voting. Now the remaining 3 have to compete with like 7-8 other candidates, while Evan didn't. Can yo usee the flaw and unfairness in the above vote? I will say it again, back to zero is the only way to do it in a fair way. 13:18, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * Totally agree.
 * Jinbe does have a point but to do that MDM has to deny or acept the nomination before.

Sorry, I know this is a somewhat serious matter, but I couldn't resist. http://s1.directupload.net/images/120225/gs4u8bhq.jpg 13:46, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I don't see how threataning someone who is begging for a ban by insulting me and actually asking for it shouldn't get a warning. --68.43.152.51 14:35, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

(comments removed by author - AY - 17:46, February 25, 2012 (UTC))

It might seem cruel to remove the chatmods, but it is also unfair and "cruel" to those who are more than capable of fullfilling the position, but didn't had the priviledge of being chosen by one single person (with absolutely weird reasoning, "the first 4 who apply"). It is simply a slap in the face for many regulars here and not the way things are usually done on the wiki. I admit DP can not really be blamed for that, but it proves again that consulting the community first is always the way to go.

Now to your suggestion to simply promote everyone else we see fit. You realise that we would end up with 3/4 of the regulars being a chatmod if we do that, don't you? What is the point of having mods in the first place if everyone gets to be one? To me, being an admin, chatmod or whatever, is a duty, a service for the community (and certainly a burden at times). But it appears that some are simply after some sort of special position, just for the sake of it.

Anyway, I still propose to remove them all and do a proper nomination/vote to get things sorted once and for all. 16:59, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

We all waited to have voting priviliges so why should you be exempt from the wait? why are you so special that just because you are incapable of voting we have to change the rules? I admire you shared your opinion but i have to say i am not in favor of giving you vote priviliges.

AYET, I am only 15 and I know very well that right now it's tragic and sad and every negative thing you may find. But it will pass. Now for Jinbe's proposal, I must completely agree with it. Reverting it back to no new 4 chat moderators. To make it even fairer, I propose another thing. That all chat moderators should be chosen democratically. If that is to be fairest then all should be as Jinbe said, reverted to 0; And all the chat mods till now reproposed and democratically elected, but only those proposed by the community.

Ayet, half a year ora year is a lot of time. You can't even imagine how much changes in just half a year! A trial that long...that's longer than the period of time I've been as a chat moderator till now! and one year? I haven't even been here one year. A period of trial is also a bad idea! If they are bad chat moderators and screw things up it's not gonna be good at all. Jinbe is indeed right, reverting it all back to 0. I am ready to bet my right as a chat moderator just for things to be as fair as possible and so that the decision would not belong to only one person and I'd say fair. What if you are not chosen as a chat moderator? Is it your dream job? Is it really so amazing? I don't think so, My dad asked me today. "What is the advantage of being a chat mod?" I answered him: "Nothing, it's just a load of responsibility. But at least I can take care of the chat and making sure chaos does not appear in it". It is only responsability. For those of you who might want to become a chat mod just for more respect and stuff like that, you are wrong, you don't earn respect for being a chat moderator, you earn it for being responsible. I still have seen no posts from the admin who has done this, agreeing or not agreeing to what is going on. So I speculate that he will agree to the final results and our methods, because they are "democratic".

Without proof? I know the people of the chat for a very long while and I know them pretty well, and we know each other well as well. Tucky still labels ST, Panda and IH only as trolls, but you know, that's at first glance, he doesn't know more than that because he hasn't seem them in other situations, hasn't pmed them, etc, Ofc I don't pm ST, but I know him well enough and we should all know that he has edited a lot on this wiki, participated in many discussions and so on, IH is also one of the older memebers, older than even DP, made great predictions and then Shiv, who has way more main edits than me, more knowledge and whatnot are seen as simple trolls. They act differently in different situations and with different people. That's why democracy si the best choice, some people see them like that, some people see them like this. It comes from different perspectives and not from one. And that is exactly why (repeating myself again) this decision should belong to not one individual.

MOM, I wish to clarify myself that I was not asking for any voting rights, seriously.

Jinbe-san & Rici-kun,I acknowledge I overstepped my line, I withdraw my comments. I think you are right that you guys know this well, I will not get in the way of the democracy here. My sincere apologies.- AY - 17:46, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I see What stance Rici has on the whole thing, but for once i sort of agree with Tucky, Panda and Hungry have chosen to act like trolls, so people cannot be shocked whe they are treated as such. It seems the people who are elected don't give a flying rats ass about there position, the community cares more about their position than they do. They aren't seemingly protecting it. I don't know guys, why you judge admins on accolades than on experience in stopping problems rather than inducing the problems.

Well, I suppose I must do what I always do. Meme time!

Anyways, I'm fine with the votes. 21:38, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Another possibility
Jinbe suggested that all the newly-added chat moderators should have their status removed and then a chat moderator election should begin. He is right at that because it is indeed the fairest way. The people who will be voted for will all only be suggested by the community, not options chosen by one man. Be honest, this wasn't right. you know it well. You, the 4 chat mods should just give up your position for now and accept a formal election. As you saw the results are negative for all of the 4 right now. And you should know very clearly, I personally have not voted for no, because I hate you, it is because I see you unfited to be a chat mod. That is the reason why a new election should begin, with better options where people will tend to vote for a yes and not for a "no". That would make everything fair. I suggest we begin with this method and end the previous "test" vote as soon as possible. Now do you agree that another vote should be made, just as Jinbe stated, starting it out at 0? Or rather do you actually have anything against it? <p style="border-style: initial; border-color: initial; font-style: normal;">'''Because if not, we can get over with this thing sooner than you think. '''

<p style="border-style: initial; border-color: initial; font-style: normal;">

<p style="border-style: initial; border-color: initial; font-style: normal;">This vote will actually get shit done and solve every problem so I support this full on

Since I do believe that I was picked as a chat mod unfairly, I am stepping down my chat mod position and prefer to get the position fairly. Right now it is a tie for me, but I give up and want the new voting to start.

Very mature decision. Now this leaves us with 3 completely outvoted candidates and one stepping down. There is no reason to wait any longer for the nomination phase (which I of course support, Rici) 21:18, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I step down as well. More people deserve it than me. 21:35, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

No reason to wait any longer indeed. I will start the official Chat Moderator Elections.

Chat Moderator Elections
The 4 new chosen chat mods will be demoded and will be automatically nominated and taken into consideration for the official vote as if nominated by DP.

One can nominate himself or other people on this forum.

The nomination time is 4 days and it will end wednesday at 8 pm UTC.

Every nominated person must agree to be part of the elections, everyone has the chance to accept taking part or not. So I will ask that the 4 ones chosen by DP say if they wish to accept being part of the official vote.

The nominations from the earlier part of this forum will not be taken into consideration as this is more like a fresh start.

I will also tell you the number of moderators that will be chosen at the end of the official vote, through multivoting (I'm not gonna show you an example so here is a short description: It will be vote with multiple options and you can choose every option if you want, multi-voting as in voting for 4 options at the same time. The options are the nominated people and if you vote for them, it means you agree to that user receiving chat mod rights)

The number of chat mods to get chosen through vote are 4. Feel free to discuss this and suggest another amount.

So you may start nominating!

To begin, I will nominate User:Pandawarrior for the post of new chat moderator.

Nominations
Please nominate people here.

http://onepiece.wikia.com/index.php?title=User_blog:Monkey.D.Me/FLASH_NEWS_!!!_New_Chat_Mods&page=2&cb=5823 Everybody on the poll along with X-Raptor and MDM SeaTerror 23:03, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Now I'm nominating JOP. SeaTerror 23:12, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I think I would be a good mod, so i'm nominating myself and Hungry. Dmurray1031 23:14, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

As I've said in my earlier post. I nominate Nada and MJ 23:19, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Everyone seems to be covered...I go with Jopfan and Dmurray (if he isn't already mentioned), Sff9 and...hm...maybe more later. 23:24, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I nominate Evan 23:25, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I nominate NWW, he would also be another good nomination.

I nominate MDM, if nobody has already. 02:53, February 26, 2012 (UTC)

I nominate Jinbe and Neowitch.

I nominate MoM

I nominate PX, how come he hasn't been earlier?

As granted the option by Ricizubi, and at the request of various users, I hereby rescind Tuckyd's candidacy for chatmod. 04:38, February 28, 2012 (UTC)
 * wtf? 10:53, February 28, 2012 (UTC)


 * At the first glance I didn't get the word "rescind".. .. I didn't get it at second glance either so finally I took shelter under Google search and I was not by the result. DP's English really surpasses my understanding. Thou I understand why Panda is going "wft" but .. .. some things shall be left unsaid. I thank you for the justice you served DP. -- 13:00, February 28, 2012 (UTC)


 * "Rescind" means to cancel. I still see his post there. Should I take it off? 05:35, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * He was nominated by ST so unless ST rescinds his nomination as well, it's still official.


 * Sorry, I don't get you two here, what do you mean by those statements? Evanalmighty 15:54, February 29, 2012 (UTC)


 * DP wants to cancel Tucky's nomination, but Rici says that he can't do that until SeaTerror, who nominated him, withdraws his nomination. 16:41, February 29, 2012 (UTC)


 * Why the fuck does dp get to cancel nominations now? 16:43, February 29, 2012 (UTC)


 * He can't, that's what we are saying. 17:00, February 29, 2012 (UTC)

Accepting nominations
Those who have been nominated, may I ask for you to please accept or refuse here.
 * 1) I accept the nomination since I was one of the demoded chat mod and I want to get it fairly this time.


 * 1) i accept the nomination, i'd be dumb to refuse Troll King Imhungry4444 23:24, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 2) I guess I accept nomination from ST lol 23:26, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 3) I accept the nomination. Thanks for the nomination me! Dmurray1031 23:26, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 4) Accepting this position will bring me one step closer to world domination. 23:56, February 25, 2012 (UTC)
 * 5) I guess I'll accept my own :D SeaTerror 00:17, February 26, 2012 (UTC)
 * 6) I'll accept my nomination. 00:21, February 26, 2012 (UTC)
 * 7) I will give it a try. Evanalmighty 01:27, February 26, 2012 (UTC)
 * 08:19, February 26, 2012 (UTC) So will I. I probably won't make it, but that never stopped Luffy or Freddie Mercury.
 * 1) How could i deny my adoring public ( only one person)
 * 2) Screw it, I accept. If I am a mod, you bet I will be spending a lot more time on the chat. 02:52, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 3) I don't refuse.

Discussion
Ten nominees, huh? This oughta be fun... 08:28, February 26, 2012 (UTC)

Indeed. Evanalmighty 08:31, February 26, 2012 (UTC)

Looks like I am in, but if in the end I end up facing someone who might make much better mod then me, I will drop out. But for now, LETS DO THIS SHIT !!! -- 09:06, February 26, 2012 (UTC)

Argh. Looks like I can die anytime. Evanalmighty 09:07, February 26, 2012 (UTC)

Sorry people who nominated me but my final decission is a no! Sorry for all who believed in me but my heart speaks louder right now, besides it's not like the mod status holds any significance to me, it's just an acessory, what I have done in my stay is way more important then a title to show that people trust me. Good luck to all you new mods ^^ I'll still watch all over you and watch you grow to awesome users like I've been doing for some time now

I am really really sorry to people who nominated me. It was a honor to be nominated for such status and I thank you from bottom of my heart but i don't think I can do this. I think of myself as Garp of this wikia just how MJ is Sengoku. I like to help new members feel home and help out wiki with best I can. Rest of time I don't take work any seriously just like Garp and may end up being unrealiabe so I think its best to give that chance to someone worthy like Panda, Murray or calu. I am sorry for changing my mind like this in the end. Thank you for nomination and sorry for all these troubles. 19:12, February 26, 2012 (UTC)

Oi I'm not sengoku XD I'm Ace if anyone!

Ok, so when are we doing this? 19:14, February 27, 2012 (UTC)

This Wednesday 8 PM UTC, as I have already stated.

Ok if i'm doing this right 8 PM UTC would be 2 PM CST correct? 20:26, February 27, 2012 (UTC)

What would U.S. central time be? I know four people (MoM, DP, Ryu, and me) who live in that zone. 21:34, February 27, 2012 (UTC)

@Nada I live in US central too, and it would be 2 PM on Wednesday. 21:43, February 27, 2012 (UTC)

I dont read this discussion for like,a day,and look where it's goten!!!! In any case.Good luck to the contestants.Maybe the best win XD

2 PM Wednesday, huh? Looks like I won't make it. I have an education to keep up with. 23:15, February 27, 2012 (UTC)

Central time users fight for your rights!!! and plus there are a significant number of people from that time zone who are students, or have jobs.

You don't have to be present at the start of the vote, it will be ongoing for several days... 23:51, February 27, 2012 (UTC)

I was waiting for someone to put a logical end to this meaningless argument and Panda did it .. .. thank you Panda.-- 00:35, February 28, 2012 (UTC)

So if we don't have to be here when it starts...what's the point of giving a time?!

This is madness! 01:29, February 28, 2012 (UTC)

The point of giving a time is, that due to timezones, saying it will start wednesday is not sufficient enough, your wednesday starts after my wednesday for example, so without a given time this could lead to confusion. 01:32, February 28, 2012 (UTC)

I shall add that this date is not only that of the beginning of the poll, but also that of the end of nominations, hence the need of a precise time.

I known I havent been here for very long but I would like to make a suggestion.There is a period of about 8 or more hours in which their are no chatmods on and I know for a fact that none of the nominated people are on during this period of time, except towards the end of that period Panda and Evan are on (sometimes). So i would like to make thesuggestion that you pic one person from my time zone, (Australia) to become a chatmod. Straw Hat Boy 12:04, February 28, 2012 (UTC)

I see that as i mentioned we still have the TimeLine problems,and we should solve them.So yeah we should at least avoid getting a auropean Mod,esecially from Greece/Romania TL,since there are 2 from that timeline.Also we have an active american mod.

I just hope people seriously take the time zones into acount we dont need 3 chat mods in the chat at the same time of day that is just really stupid. and everyone up for nomination are in similar timezones. We would only need one from europe and definatly none from america. pick at least one person from eastern asia or australia. Straw Hat Boy 13:19, February 28, 2012 (UTC)

We currently have 1 active chatmod. DP and ryu dont visit the chat regularly (at least from what I can tell) and LPK hasn't logged in for a week. Also rici leaves comparatively, as he has school duties. Timezones don't mean particularly much in my opinion, I'm the most active on the chat at midnight my time, which overlaps with the time most americans are on. Also while I agree that we could use a chatmod from SEA, the only possible candidate has been here for 3 1/2 months only, and is thus not that experienced. I'm not trying to flame, or anything, just pointing things out. 13:46, February 28, 2012 (UTC)

I just wanted to say... it's of course the best having always an active chat mod, but I don't think it's the end of the world if there isn't always one active. It's not like having a vandal on the wiki and no admin active... a troll in the chat can be at the wrost annoying. Well I don't come often to the chat so I may be out of place in saying this. That said good luck with the election.

Formal Vote
'''So please vote. '''
 * So to go over the rules once again
 * The vote will last 1 week (till the 7th of March)and another week if there are any problems or there is a tie
 * You will have to vote for the 4 people you find most suited for the position of chat moderator
 * The requirements to vote are 300 edits and 3 months of contributing on this wiki
 * From this election 4 new chat moderators will be chosen, the 4 most voted for

Which are the 4 people from the following list which you find best suited for receiving the rights of a chat moderator?

Claudia

 * 20:00, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 20:09, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 20:17, February 29, 2012 (UTC) As promised.
 * 20:26, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 20:36, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 20:54, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 21:02, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1)   22:08, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 2)   22:12, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 3)   22:33, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 4)   11:24, March 1, 2012 (UTC)
 * 5)   15:10, March 2, 2012 (UTC) GANBARE!!!!
 * 1)   11:24, March 1, 2012 (UTC)
 * 2)   15:10, March 2, 2012 (UTC) GANBARE!!!!
 * 1)   15:10, March 2, 2012 (UTC) GANBARE!!!!

Imhungry

 * 20:00, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 20:23, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 20:28, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 20:53, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 15:11, March 2, 2012 (UTC)
 * 15:12, March 2, 2012 (UTC)
 * 15:12, March 2, 2012 (UTC)

DMurray

 * 1) Troll King Imhungry4444 20:16, February 29, 2012 (UTC)

Panda

 * 20:10, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1) Troll King Imhungry4444 20:16, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 20:25, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 20:30, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 20:40, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 21:02, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1)   22:08, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 2)   22:12, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 3)   22:33, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 4)   02:39, March 1, 2012 (UTC)
 * 11:25, March 1, 2012 (UTC)
 * 15:10, March 2, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1)   02:39, March 1, 2012 (UTC)
 * 11:25, March 1, 2012 (UTC)
 * 15:10, March 2, 2012 (UTC)
 * 11:25, March 1, 2012 (UTC)
 * 15:10, March 2, 2012 (UTC)

Seaterror

 * 20:10, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1) Troll King Imhungry4444 20:18, February 29, 2012 (UTC)

Evan

 * 20:00, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 20:10, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 21:02, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 02:20, March 1, 2012 (UTC)
 * 02:27, March 1, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1)   03:12, March 1, 2012 (UTC)
 * 2)   11:25, March 1, 2012 (UTC)
 * 3)   15:10, March 2, 2012 (UTC)

Nada

 * 20:00, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 20:47, February 29, 2012 (UTC)

Man of Myth

 * 20:31, February 29, 2012 (UTC)

Pacifista

 * 21:02, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 21:02, February 29, 2012 (UTC)

Sff9

 * 1) Troll King Imhungry4444 20:18, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 20:18, February 29, 2012 (UTC) Vote for this guy, even if you don't know him.
 * 20:28, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 20:32, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 20:49, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1)   22:08, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 2)   22:14, February 29, 2012 (UTC) I noticed Jinbe said "him".
 * 22:21, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 11:25, March 1, 2012 (UTC)
 * 1)   22:14, February 29, 2012 (UTC) I noticed Jinbe said "him".
 * 22:21, February 29, 2012 (UTC)
 * 11:25, March 1, 2012 (UTC)
 * 11:25, March 1, 2012 (UTC)
 * 11:25, March 1, 2012 (UTC)