Talk:Big Mom Pirates

Mam vs. Mom
Databooks are considered to have inaccurate romanizations and translations. So Mam is more accurate. 22:53, December 26, 2011 (UTC)

Chapter 651. Oda wrote it as "Big Mom".DemonRin 22:54, December 26, 2011 (UTC)

since oda wrote it as big mom in the data book as well as the more recent chapter 651, and has only written the "mam" once in a chapter quite some time ago we can assume he simply made a mistake when he wrote mam195.1.67.181 00:26, December 27, 2011 (UTC)

I know the databooks are supposed to be less accurate, but Mom does beat Mam 2-1 in terms of use. I say we should go with the majority on this one. 00:30, December 27, 2011 (UTC)

A mistake is more possible. The difference between the Arabasta and Albasta one is that Oda used Arabasta during the actual arc while he used Big Mom in the new chapter that is actually related to her. SeaTerror 02:30, December 27, 2011 (UTC)

Mistake or no mistake, it's 2:1 currently. Let it be as Mom, unless we have confirmation LATER. 03:36, December 27, 2011 (UTC)

Nothing to protect Fisherman Island?
Is it really fair to say so? The deal was to protect them from the invasion of other pirate crews in exchange of candy. If they did nothing about the civil war it is, as they said, because that's not their problem. Protecting them from the civil war would mean they'd have to take a side, meaning they would end attacking citizens they are paid to protect.

From what I remember no one in Fisherman Island ever said Big Mam had failed them, so I don't think it's fair to write that. It's been a while since I last read that arc, so I may be forgetting a frame or 2. But I don't remember any complaints regarding her services, except maybe how expensive and unreasonable it was. 190.47.205.207 17:10, January 23, 2013 (UTC)Seba.

Ship's figurehead
Has anyone else noticed that the face on the ship moves to face toward the thousand sunny? in all the frames the ship appears in, you can tell the head moves like it's looking toward the ship. 12.166.75.230 01:23, December 8, 2013 (UTC)

I wouldn't be surprised, it can sing. m 02:26, December 8, 2013 (UTC)

I'm chalking it up to comical artistic license. Don't overthink it. 02:37, December 8, 2013 (UTC)

Connection to Law?
One of the Big Mom pirates (the girl with three eyes) looks a lot like one of the kids from Law's hometown, Flevance (Chapter 762, page 11). Etsyets (talk) 17:47, October 9, 2014 (UTC)

That's not a third eye. SeaTerror (talk) 18:15, October 9, 2014 (UTC)

Allies/Underlings: FireTank Pirates
Wasn't it pretty much confirmed they allied themselves with Big Mom? Or were they just randomly taking a stroll in her ship?

Grievous67 (talk) 20:25, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

We have no idea what he was doing on their ship. As likely as an alliance is, we have no confirmation. 20:30, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

Alright then, stroll it is I guess XD

Grievous67 (talk) 20:55, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

Alice's Adventures in Wonderland
For SeaTerror sake: Should the references be included in the trivia? Rhavkin (talk) 11:28, May 6, 2016 (UTC)

It seems similar enough to me to be a reference. And our rules state that if you think One Piece is referencing something, feel free to add it, just be prepared to defend it if someone else disagrees.

12:24, May 6, 2016 (UTC)

Yeah, the soldiers and the talking doors make the reference pretty evident to me Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 12:29, May 6, 2016 (UTC)

Lately they've been saying that they have a more general "fairy tale" theme, and I'm inclined to agree with them. And it just occurred to me today that the talking ship and door and flowers and things could be a reference to The Powder of Life from the Wizard of Oz novels. Bet you dollars to donuts that Big Mom has some sort of power like that at her disposal (whether it be from a Devil Fruit or from Germa 66). 99.52.193.151 21:07, June 1, 2016 (UTC)

Somethings can reference several stories, like Chocolat town referencing both "Hansel and Gretel" and "Charlie and the Chocolate Factory". Rhavkin (talk) 05:33, June 2, 2016 (UTC)

Sounds okay if the references are obvious, but try not to go overboard, or we may reach the border between simple reference and speculation. 05:35, June 2, 2016 (UTC)

Overflowing Trivia
Well the trivia section is extremely long and pretty much a mess. I think that we should move the fairy tale themed reference to each character\island personal page and leave only the general references like the door and the soldiers and then add in the end "Additionally, several crew members, Charlotte family members, islands and location also have reference fairy tale element." Barto mafia family (talk) 17:35, August 5, 2016 (UTC)

I agree. There are trivia about people and places that have nothing to do with Big Mom pirates themselves. I tried deleting a few but my edits were undone. Dinosel (talk) 17:42, August 5, 2016 (UTC)

I'm not saying "Delete", I'm saying "Move". Barto mafia family (talk) 17:51, August 5, 2016 (UTC)

Those trivia already exist in the trivia section of the character they were supposed to be. Dinosel (talk) 17:59, August 5, 2016 (UTC)

Agreed, only have some general trivia here and limit the character-specific stuff to their individual pages. 18:08, August 5, 2016 (UTC)

There seems to be no objection. I'll start copying what's not already on the individual's pages, but I don't know how long we need to wait before removing them from this page. Barto mafia family (talk) 18:34, August 5, 2016 (UTC)

Crew Bounty
The page says "At least 1.3 Billion Berri". As far As I'm aware, the only Big Mom Pirate whose bounty we know of is Pekoms, which is 330 Million. Could someone explain to me where this bounty comes from? Or I'll change it to the correct one.

AnonMadness

That figure includes the total known bounties of the Firetank and Sun Pirates as well as Caesar Clown. Whether they should be included since they are not actual crew members can be debated. Also, please sign your name with ~. 04:54, August 15, 2016 (UTC)

Remove them. It should only include direct members. SeaTerror (talk) 07:04, August 15, 2016 (UTC)

It depends on how intimately you want to use the word subordinate. 07:09, August 15, 2016 (UTC)

Subordinates shouldnt count in the total bounty... only direct members like Pekoms since the Fire Tank Pirates are still a seperate pirate crew that just works under Big Mom Pirates and is not an actual part of it. Dinosel (talk) 07:41, August 15, 2016 (UTC)

Bege and Jinbe are under Big Mom so their bounties should count. Caesar is a hired outsider and so shouldn't be included (which I don't think he is) Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 12:59, August 15, 2016 (UTC)

It's the total bounty of the Big Mom Pirates. Not "Big Mom's subordinates" or whatever. Only count the actual crew or put both counts there. 14:58, August 15, 2016 (UTC)

Okay, I see, so Caesar Bege and Jinbe were included to get that figure. As others have said, I think that's wrong to include their bounties in the bounty of the Big Mom Pirates. I mean, had Luffy accepted the Grand Fleet as it was originally proposed, would we include Barto's and Cavendish's bounties in the SHs? Nah. Even though they would have been direct subordinates. (I know they are not, but it's a hypothetical.) So why do we do it for the BM Pirates? We shouldn't. 68.229.94.10 19:12, August 15, 2016 (UTC)AnonMadness

The Big Mom Pirates are built on the foundation of the children's marriage to outside crew, so Bege and Aladine marrying into the Charlotte family means they become part of the Big Mom Pirates. So all bounties should be included. 19:18, August 15, 2016 (UTC)

Then as a previous commentor mentioned, two figures should be given. One for only BM Pirates, and one more expansve figure for all affiliates. 68.229.94.10 19:48, August 15, 2016 (UTC)AnonMadness

As Purin said, the crew is built on such marriages, so the moment they marry themselves to a member of the Big Mom Pirates, the so-called subordinate crew is truly part of the Big Mom Pirates. 20:25, August 15, 2016 (UTC)

It's the same subordinate crew system Whitebeard Pirates and Beasts Pirates have. The main crewmembers are labelled as "Big Mom Pirates" while the subordinates are only referred to as such. Now, let's just add both figures and be done with this. 17:15, August 18, 2016 (UTC)

Why? Only the direct members belong. You might as well add the grand fleet's bounty to the Straw Hat template by that logic. SeaTerror (talk) 17:51, August 18, 2016 (UTC)

Spoken like someone who hasn't read the discussion. Subordinate crews are different than branch crews. 17:54, August 18, 2016 (UTC)

If that was true then the Blackbeard Pirates' bounties would all be different too. SeaTerror (talk) 18:01, August 18, 2016 (UTC)

Add both figures, one for the direct members of the Big Mom Pirates, and one for the subordinate crews under the Big Mom Pirates. They both serve the same person, Big Mom, and I see no reason to separate them. 18:36, August 18, 2016 (UTC)

Just have a bounty for the members of the Big Mom Pirates, not her subordinates. Meshack (talk) 19:17, August 18, 2016 (UTC)

Same word is used in Japanese for Sun Pirates to Big Mom Pirates as Barto Club to Straw Hat Pirates or A.O Pirates to Whitebeard Pirates. The fact that the English versions can't settle on whether sanka should be translated as subordinate/affiliate/ally/branch in the circumstances doesn't mean that they're any different (just like nakama can be translated to friend/crew/comrade). 107.6.122.154 09:02, August 19, 2016 (UTC)

It's been a month, nobody reject to the two bounties, can we close this? Barto mafia family (talk) 14:25, September 19, 2016 (UTC)

The bounty should reflect direct members of the Big Mom like the Sweet Commanders, Pekmoms, Tamago, and the yonko herself 01:44, October 14, 2016 (UTC)

No objections to having two figures other than Drake? Ok then. 17:20, November 13, 2016 (UTC)

Four Sweet Commanders
In the last chapter it was revealed that the Sweet Commanders were originally 4.

Do we stay with Three Sweet commanders? Do we change it to Four Sweet Commanders? Or i suggest calling them just Sweet Commanders. Dinosel (talk) 11:38, August 25, 2016 (UTC)

The Shichibukai are only 5 (currently) and their name didn't change. They are called "Three Sweet Commodores" in the infobox so if their actual number is what determined the name, then it wouldn't be right to change or remove the number. Rhavkin (talk) 21:28, August 27, 2016 (UTC)

Stick with Three Sweet Commanders. If there were meant to be four then someone else would have replaced the one Urogue defeated, but they are rolling with three 22:05, September 22, 2016 (UTC)

Organization
in chapter 853 soldiers requested minister class backup to handle luffy.Does that mean the crew is divided between the commanders, ministers and regular crew members? They could be the equivalent to the executive members of the donquixote pirates.Gregroden93 (talk) 22:14, January 28, 2017 (UTC)

The Ministers
I was wondering if more ministers are introduced in the arc, can we add a Minsters 'section under Sweet Commanders? Alpha Omega Plus (talk) 23:21, February 4, 2017 (UTC)

Pirate Vs. Citizen
I was wondering, where is the line (I ask this specifically for Big Mom's kids) between Big Mom Pirate and Charlotte Family? The family has total control of the island and is integrated among the public, which is why people like Pudding are so well known and not feared. Pudding is doing active work for Big Mom by marrying Sanji, whose family's military tech Big Mom will then use in her pirate crew. So wouldn't that make her a member of the Big Mom Pirates? See where my confusion is? Chiffon, Praline, and for the sake of argument let's include Pudding, due to their marriages, have made subordinate to Big Mom various pirate crews,ie the Firetank, Sun, and Straw Hats respectively, becoming an extension of the Big Mom Pirates, not the Charlotte Family, yet they're listed as citizens. Do we consider them contractors? I'm also going to throw Brulee into the mix because she also took orders from Big Mom. So do we consider them part of the crew? Am I not drawing a line between Big Mom as captain and Big Mom as queen? I feel like some clarification is in order. 03:24, February 10, 2017 (UTC)

The line is whether or not they ware confirmed as members. So far the only family and crew members are the Sweet Commanders (Cracker and Smoothie) and those who took part in the enrage army (Mont d'Or, Opera and Galette).

As for the "Contractors", those who have been confirmed (Chiffon and Praline} aren't even listed as a part of their husbands crew. They are not pirates.

The family members who follow orders (Brûlée, Perospero, and Pudding) are shown to be more than a loyal family. The rest of the family (Moscato, Anana, Dolce, Dragée, and Anglais) didn't seem to be more then a minister and regular children. Lola and Pound are somewhat excluded from and by the rest of the family.

Basicly, Big Mom does whatever she wants in her territory, and her kids are also given some of those privileges. As a pirate, she also have several children as crew members, but not all of them. Rhavkin (talk) 07:55, February 10, 2017 (UTC)

I see, I guess it's just difficult for me to differentiate between Big Mom the pirate and Charlotte Linlin the queen. 08:05, February 10, 2017 (UTC)

Crew Members
There was an inconsistency on the page; the members the enraged army was part of the big mom crew on this page, but it is not mentioned (explicitly) anywhere. And in this case, why not to put Brûlée in the crew because enraged army = big mom's crew, so why seducing woods is not part of the crew? Because it is there that Big Mom crush the pirates who come to its territory, it is still more probable that army enraged = crew of big mom. It is like Diesel, it was never seen presented in the crew as such but attacking an island.

So I ask for a renovation of the crew members after the discussion I had with User:AuroraOfDeath.

What do you think? I propose in the first place to put all the ministers as a member, because the Charlotte Family described as the core of the crew and that Pudding said that Charlotte Family = crew base. Also, read this Jinbei includes the ministers in the crew ("within").

Anyway, saying that the enraged army is part of the crew it is supposition (the mention that Big Mom orders them to shoot Luffy is not evidence, in my opinion).

-- Mihawk http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/sedali/images/c/c6/Moha2.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/35?cb=20160826212954talk:Mihawk Moha Moha  23:02, May 5, 2017 (UTC)

No. Working in the family business and working for the crew are completely different. It's like the Kuja. Not every member of the tribe is a member of the pirate crew. I'll admit the line between family and crew member is blurry, but we can't assume they're the same thing. Diesel and Randolph could have been working under orders from a minister, rather than a crew member. 16:25, May 6, 2017 (UTC)

Jinbe indeed seems to imply that the ministers are all part of the crew. 17:05, May 6, 2017 (UTC)

DancePowderer : As I said, Jinbe included ministers in the crew (http://mangafox.me/manga/one_piece/vTBD/c857/10.html). So why put some ministers, not all? Mihawk http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/sedali/images/c/c6/Moha2.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/35?cb=20160826212954talk:Mihawk Moha| Moha  18:23, May 6, 2017 (UTC)

We just got two ministers' infoboxes and it didn't say Big Mom Pirates like it did for Cracker and Smoothie. Rhavkin (talk) 08:02, May 7, 2017 (UTC)

Well first off, it'd be nice to get a more reliable translation of Jinbe's line. With the Enraged Army, the Vinsmokes noted their epithets and bounties so they are most certainly part of the crew. 19:40, May 7, 2017 (UTC)

I wanted to ask before I edit the Crew Members section and saw that there is already a discussion so I'll just jump in. Since the last post, It was revealed that all ministers are Charlotte Family members, so I wanted to suggest to remove the Ministers sub-title, and replace it with a Charlotte Family Members. Rhavkin (talk) 21:08, December 12, 2017 (UTC)

Go ahead Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 00:16, January 19, 2018 (UTC)

Adding Sections
I actually have a question pertaining to this. In the 'others' category of the crew member picture chart, we have Diesel, Streusen, and Custard. I think Custard should be moved into the family section on account of his name, as it's very likely he is a son of Big Mom. Stueusen I feel should have his own category, chefs, and the WCI 31 should be added to it. I'm not sure where Diesel should go. Does anyone know who manages the picture chart? I'm still new to some of this stuff.(Yeomanaxel (talk) 22:40, February 11, 2018 (UTC))

We're not gonna make assumptions about Custard. Tamago has a food based name too but he doesn't seem to be a family member Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 22:46, February 11, 2018 (UTC)

I noticed that Smoothie's picture in the gallery was changed a while ago. I personally liked the last one better because the shading was more consistent with Cracker's picture next to it. The current one looks a little flat. Could we have whoever's in charge of the gallery do a comparison of the two? Or is this not that big an issue?(Yeomanaxel (talk) 01:11, February 18, 2018 (UTC))

Cracker has a different complexion than Smoothie which is why their portraits look different shade-wise, in addition to the contrast of their hair colors. Smoothie's previous portrait looked different because it was shadowed a bit, and we don't use shadowed portraits if we can help it. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 01:23, February 18, 2018 (UTC)

Charlotte Boire
Hey, you forgot to add Boire in the template of the article of the Big Mom Pirates. Alpha Omega Plus (talk) 03:18, March 1, 2018 (UTC)

Pekom's Betrayal
Now that Pekoms has betrayed the crew to help Luffy escape Cocao Island, should we place the double-cross symbol next to his gallery picture? (Yeomanaxel (talk) 01:16, March 14, 2018 (UTC))

He is yet to be kicked out and we don't know how he will be punished exactly.

Pssst, hey
https://mobile.twitter.com/undergroundTKG/status/985420784284811264 --66.87.125.3 14:15, April 15, 2018 (UTC)

Is this information verifiable? I just checked the gallery, and the guy with the horned helmet is there but not the man with antlers. Why is that? (Yeomanaxel (talk) 17:56, April 15, 2018 (UTC))

Those character have already been added to the gallery and navibox. The names can be discussed on each character page. As for the credibility of the family ties, there is another discussion on the Charlotte Family talk page, so there is no need to continue this one. Rhavkin (talk) 20:05, April 15, 2018 (UTC)

Charlotte Table and Charlotte Saint-Marc
Hello, I think that Table and Saint-Marc are two members of Charlotte Family and, in addition, members of Big Mom Pirates. In this picture, we can see to Tablet and Saint-Marc behind Perospero, but, we can't see other members of Big Mom Pirates like Streusen. Tamago and Pekoms appear as important characters in this arc. If they appeared like member of Big Mom Pirates, Streusen would appear too. I know that it's an anime picture, but, Toei have all information of Charlotte Family and it's used by them in the anime.

I'm sorry by my bad English. El Principe (talk) 15:58, April 16, 2018 (UTC)

Sorry it's taken so long for someone to respond. I agree that they're probably Charlottes, but we don't have full confirmation yet. They're only credited with their first names and that isn't enough. Furthermore, as mentioned above, this is a matter better suited for the Charlotte Family talk page. (Yeomanaxel (talk) 21:16, May 3, 2018 (UTC))

The Dosmarche Debacle
Well, now that we know for certain that Dosmarche is the mustached man with the sword with an orange thread attached to it, that confirms Basskarte as the fire-guy with overly long sleeves. We should add a picture to his gallery entry. (Yeomanaxel (talk) 13:04, May 6, 2018 (UTC))

How is that a confirmation? Rhavkin (talk) 13:08, May 6, 2018 (UTC) I suppose it's not an official confirmation. It just makes sense to me as he's the only other possible family member that was present during the battle with Germa. Nevermind, I'm getting ahead of myself. (Yeomanaxel (talk) 13:11, May 6, 2018 (UTC))

Antler Man
I thought we got antler man's name at the same time we got Saint-Marc's. Am I wrong? If I'm not, we should add him in. (Yeomanaxel (talk) 23:50, May 17, 2018 (UTC))

High-Fat
Thank you to everyone who got everything updated with Zuccotto and Kanten. I have a question regarding a very large member of the BM Pirates, the one who wears a blue, polka-dotted onsie and sports a brown mustache. I distinctly remember hearing his voice in the epsiode, and apparently his name is High-Fat. Why hasn't he been put in yet? (Yeomanaxel (talk) 02:17, June 4, 2018 (UTC))

Devil Fruit Powers
The trivia that was added is valid. The Beasts pirates have mostly SMILEs which are not real Devil Fruits. SeaTerror (talk) 07:01, March 17, 2019 (UTC)

Who said that unnatural aren't real? Rhavkin (talk) 07:03, March 17, 2019 (UTC)

Artificial Devil Fruits are still Devil Fruits. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 11:54, March 17, 2019 (UTC)

Just change the wording to natural Devil Fruits. Problem solved. 17:31, March 17, 2019 (UTC)

Kage's suggestion is probably the best idea but artificial fruits are not actual Devil Fruits. Artificial is another word for fake. SeaTerror (talk) 07:17, March 18, 2019 (UTC)

Extremely Powerful Devil Fruits
This is speculation and doesn't apply especially since Smoothie was barely shown to have used her powers. SeaTerror (talk) 07:01, March 17, 2019 (UTC)

I'm not sure any of their Devil Fruits qualify as "extremely powerful" from the outset. They transform into mochi, dehydrate people, and create biscuits. Rather, every Sweet Commander has used their powers well in battle. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 11:58, March 17, 2019 (UTC)

We have "Extremely Powerful" characters (even though there's no objective way to tag someone as that) not devil fruits. 22:51, March 17, 2019 (UTC)

Yes that applies more to characters than actual powers. I thought we decided not to use words like extremely in general anyway since it's too subjective. SeaTerror (talk) 07:17, March 18, 2019 (UTC)

I rewrote the section Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 18:47, March 18, 2019 (UTC)

Enraged Army
Can anyone please create a page for the Enraged Army? It should be similar to the Orochi Oniwabanushu page with a template including all the members of the Big Mom Pirates that participated in the Enraged ArmyMohammedabri2312 (talk) 18:01, April 1, 2019 (UTC)

The more accurate term for them is "Forces of Rage", which isn't an official name of an actual group so much as a description of the people that gathered together to avenge Cracker. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 19:42, April 1, 2019 (UTC)

oldest active crew
how is this not speculative we lirteally do not know how long kaido crew been around and there and happo navy has been around for 13 generations which would make the the longest active pirate crewTo love this (talk) 05:29, March 2, 2020 (UTC)

"...oldest known active pirate crew..." unless you can say how long 13 generations are. The real reason it should be remove, is we do not now how accurate that statement is due the fact we know Big Mom left to join the Rocks Pirates about 40 years ago, and due to the name of the crew, it was very likely to have been form in his current structure after she had several infamous children and was given her epithet and as Perospero was about 10 at that time, it is stand to reason the "crew" she initial formed with Streusen was different. Rhavkin (talk) 06:03, March 2, 2020 (UTC)

13 generations is more the 300 years since this automatically makes the Happo Navy the longest acting pirate crew in the entire seriesTo love this (talk) 05:57, March 3, 2020 (UTC)

Generation could be in regards to leadership, meaning there have been 13 leaders of the group, and you're assuming the Happo Navy was always a pirate crew, which was not confirm. Rhavkin (talk) 06:06, March 3, 2020 (UTC)

what are u talking about yes they always been a pirate group there no hunt of any kind they never were not pirates amd 13 generatoona mean for 13 gen means 13 gen of leaders in the crew and yeara they been active so again that make them longest axtivw crew in the seriesTo love this (talk) 13:52, March 3, 2020 (UTC)

Generation doesn't dictate the time. The 13th leader is the grandson of the 12th, so it obviously not the chronological meaning of the word. Rhavkin (talk) 14:10, March 3, 2020 (UTC)

What are u talking about?yes it those chinjao was 12 gen leader meaning for all the years they been active he 12 person to become leader and the fact happou Navy has been active sense chinjao time as pirates is more proofTo love this (talk) 19:31, March 3, 2020 (UTC)

It's proof that "generation" refer to the leadership, not lineage. And Chinjao is the first known pirate leader from 30 years ago at least, BMP is from over 60 years ago. Rhavkin (talk) 21:30, March 3, 2020 (UTC)

it is proof for how long the crew been around and chronological order how many captians there been in that crew. chinjao is 78 years old big mama is 68 he ten years older then her his crew happo navy would have had 11 leaders before him   for the  big mom to have joined the rocks as a crewmember not ally or subordinate a crewmember   the big mama pirates would have stop being a crew for at least 38 years and it is clearly stated the former members then start forming there crews five years after the crew disband so during that time the happo navy was still a active pirate crew.To love this (talk) 23:27, March 3, 2020 (UTC)