Talk:Issho

Marine
If this person is sent by Fleet Admiral, then he/she must be a marine. (Also, speculation aside, my guess is a new Admiral, seeing the naming theme is a color-animal.) 07:41, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

Tell that to Kuma who was sent to deal with the Straw Hats by Sengoku. SeaTerror (talk) 08:27, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

It was the Gorosei who sent Kuma, wasn't it? Sengoku just felt angry when the cyborg reported in to Sengoku (who would in turn report to Gorosei). 10:49, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

Still a speculation, why not the unknown shichibukai, or a friend of Akainu or........ and I believe myself that he is a marine but we can't put him as a marine, yet. 11:35, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

He was sent by the head of the Marines.I think we should consider him a Marine. 12:37, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

We do not know who the person is. There's no evidence that the person is a Marine. SeaTerror (talk) 20:07, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

Then why did Sakazuki sent him? 20:41, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

Why did Sengoku send Kuma? It could be the same situation. We just don't know. We can't call the person a Marine nor Shichibukai just because we do not know who the person is. For all we know Oda could be sending a super powerful bounty hunter. SeaTerror (talk) 20:48, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

Aohige_AP:

1. color (Fujiiro) + animal (Tora), this is a unique trait for code names used for Admirals. 2. In the "furigana" rubi, the color is written in hiragana, and the animal is written in katakana. This is unique only to the Admirals in the whole manga.

CCC: Just in case anyone missed it, Fujitora is guaranteed to be an admiral by virtue of his naming scheme. It's color + animal, both written in kanji, but with the furigana for the color in hiragana and the furigana for the animal in katakana. That's way too specific a trend to be casually and intentionally applied to a different rank of Marine.

So, he must be an Admiral. RapidX (talk) 21:14, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

Still speculation regardless. We do not add (much) speculation on this wikia. We cannot just call the person an admiral. SeaTerror (talk) 21:16, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

Admiral or not, we know he's a Marine. 21:26, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

We don't know that either. It's speculation. SeaTerror (talk) 21:28, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

Sakazuki dispatched him and his naming pattern is exclusive to the admiralty. He's a Marine. 21:31, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

Sengoku dispatched Kuma to deal with the Straw Hats. Kuma is a Shichibukai. Right now the person could be anybody. We just don't know and cannot add the person as a Marine because it is speculation. SeaTerror (talk) 21:33, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

Sengoku did not dispatch Kuma to deal with the Straw Hats. He dispatched Kizaru(an Admiral). Kuma came on his own accord, without Sengoku knowing about it. RapidX (talk) 21:35, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

That isn't true at all. Sengoku even said he had an order to capture the Straw Hats. SeaTerror (talk) 21:37, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

Please give me a link to the chapter where Sengoku orders Kuma to deal with the Straw Hats then, because I don't remember that. RapidX (talk) 21:39, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

Nevermind on this part. I mixed up the story, but either way it is speculation to say that this person is a Marine. SeaTerror (talk) 21:47, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

It isn't speculation. The same way the previous Fleet Admiral Sengoku sent Kizaru(an Admiral) after the SHs, the same way now Sakazuki sent Fujitora(an Admiral too) after them. Oda told us that with the naming scheme that is unique only to the Admirals in the whole manga. That is a fact, not speculation. RapidX (talk) 21:52, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

Can't we just wait a few weeks? It's not that hard. 21:59, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

It is speculation because we do not know what the person is. spec·u·la·tion (spky-lshn) n. 1. a. Contemplation or consideration of a subject; meditation. b. A conclusion, opinion, or theory reached by conjecture. c. Reasoning based on inconclusive evidence; conjecture or supposition. SeaTerror (talk) 22:04, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

I agree with AOD, let's just take breather for a few weeks and we'll have the answer. It "is" pretty obvious that he's one of the new admirals though, ST... Do you not believe so?   ☆ Wonder-kun ☆   ┌∩┐(◣ ◢)┌∩┐    22:12, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

Yes, but at least he/she answers to Sakazuki, we know that much. 23:33, February 28, 2013 (UTC)

Unknown91 (talk) 21:02, March 14, 2013 (UTC)I think the blind guy is Fujitora

We don't know that yet, so no speculations. 21:39, March 14, 2013 (UTC)

The 50's to 70's japanese actor Shintaro Katsu bears a strong ressemblance with the blind man. He played the same character,  "Zatoichi", a blind bearded swordman in 26 movies. The blind man fits Oda's logic of creating Admirals out of "classic" japanese actors. Also each admiral represents one aspect of justice : absolute, lazy, unclear... maybe blind this time? Ardeau (talk) 21:02, March 16, 2013 (UTC)

It's a good idea and concept Ardeau, bu it's still considered speculation as of right now. Though, I do think that you are nailing it right on the head here, but it's still speculation either way... 19:16, March 16, 2013 (UTC)

I agree Ardeau, I am thinking the same thing! Reeves92 (talk) 17:14, March 27, 2013 (UTC)

Dressrosa Arc
Re-worded this section to quote the manga and specify better what Fujitora was dispatched for.

Enaura (talk) 13:49, March 21, 2013 (UTC)

Now reads:

"to "check on the situation" in Dressrosa and Luffy and Law." - as to "check on the situation" is a direct quote from Page 14: Chapter 700.

Instead of:

"to deal with Luffy and Law" - This implies that he was sent to fight them, however, as this wasn't stated, I changed it to the above.Enaura (talk) 13:57, March 21, 2013 (UTC)

Okay.

Depends on which translation you are using. SeaTerror (talk) 00:57, March 28, 2013 (UTC)

name and history
Why does it call him Issho and how do we know that the blind man is Fujitora and that he is an admiral? Currently that's all speculation. 13:58, April 10, 2013 (UTC)

Never mind I just saw the raw. 14:01, April 10, 2013 (UTC)

Remember admirals have two names, like Kuzan is also Aokiji. --Kingluffy1 (talk) 16:06, April 10, 2013 (UTC)

Can i ask about on of the most recent chapters, in which him and sabo are fighting, and he mentions how he was previously the "2nd in Command of the Revolutionary army"......i had to go back to re-read it to make sure it wasn't just the pane focused on issho, and sabo was talking, but it was definetly fujitora. You can tell by looking at how he says that he doesnt hold back, referring to himself...shouldn't something like this be in here by now......Pixelizedmario (talk) 21:31, September 1, 2014 (UTC)

So apparently like half of the sites that i checked for the information i posted on the first, had a bad translation. So if i were you i wouldnt put that in the article :3. But i blame the sites......Pixelizedmario (talk) 13:49, September 7, 2014 (UTC)

Zatoichi
Now that we finally have confirmation, can we add to the trivia section his resemblance to Zatoichi played by Shintaro Katsu? I'd do it myself but the page has understandably been locked. --Kingluffy1 (talk) 16:08, April 10, 2013 (UTC)

I agree, it's obvious he is based on him. IDoVooDoo (talk) 21:26, April 10, 2013 (UTC)

Agree though you may, I don't see him holding a sword (just a cane) and still speculation. 21:36, April 10, 2013 (UTC)

Look closely in Chapter 701: He's clearly seen holding a sword, hidden in his cane. That's just like Zatoichi. Plus, they're both blind swordsmen, and Issho looks too much like Shintaro Katsu for it to be just a coincidence in my opinion.Totoofze47 (talk) 18:45, April 11, 2013 (UTC)

Just wait for the SBS confirmation. 18:54, April 11, 2013 (UTC)

We should state that he looks like him, as allowed by the trivia guidelines. We don't have to say he's officially based on him. (Even if it's obvious.)

There's more than just looks http://thestuffyougottawatch.com/zato/zat26.jpg Aside from being blind, carrying a cane sword and having similar fashion sense they're both also gamblers. Personality wise Shintaro Katsu's Zatoichi was always friendly and cheerful right up until the point he felt people were making fun of or taking advantage of him because he was blind then he'd respond quite violently, as per Fujitora's appearance in the casino where he was playing roulette. ``visiting One Piece and Zatoichi fan.

i wonder when they will add this to the trivia i mean is so painfully obvious, al so that SBS confirmation will last forever to release, the level of skepticism of this things are some times just absurd, and at the same time have their range of appeal but really... just look at him! Doomroar (talk) 06:54, April 13, 2013 (UTC)

Unfortunately, waiting is what we do here. We cannot put up speculations without confirmation from Oda, one way or another, so patience is of the virtue. 07:22, April 13, 2013 (UTC)

Not to bring up an old subject, but am I crazy or does he look more like Takeshi Kitano's Zatoichi from the 2003 film? Rayfire (talk) 20:08, November 26, 2014 (UTC)

Issho = real name?
I must've missed the panel where they mentioned that. Where is this revealed? M4ND0N (talk) 18:33, April 10, 2013 (UTC)

http://www.batoto.net/read/_/165069/one-piece_ch705_by_mangarule/7  RapidX (talk) 19:31, April 10, 2013 (UTC)

locked...?
seriously? you locked after one faulty edit? what? i thought you should lock during edit wars only? how about people that don't speculate and wanna add stuff to the article maybe?

There's no time to classify when they "CAN" lock; the admins can always lock. But I do agree, locking it after one stupid edit is a bit silly... 17:28, April 12, 2013 (UTC)

I agree. WU out -  18:17, April 12, 2013 (UTC)

No suit + trivia?
Should it be mentioned that Fujitora's the first admiral not to wear some kind of formal suit under his standard marine coat? Akainu, Kizaru and Aokiji all obvious examples but Sengoku and the non-canon Zephyr wore suits as well whilest they were admirals. M4ND0N (talk) 03:37, April 13, 2013 (UTC)

I believe that was noted earlier but someone took it down, cause it wasn't noteworthy enough or something. though i believe that it should be put into the article somewhere--Cpt.Canuck (talk) 03:43, April 13, 2013 (UTC)

He isn't the first: Admiral Sengoku wasn't wearing a suit during the Ohara incident.
 * 海賊☠姫 (talk) 04:01, April 13, 2013 (UTC)


 * Yeah you're right. I completely forgot about that. M4ND0N (talk) 17:37, April 13, 2013 (UTC)

Antagonist
Why is he listed as an antagonist of the Pirate Alliance Saga? He did not hurt the Straw Hat Pirates and their Allies. 17:30, April 14, 2013 (UTC)

He was sent by Sakazuki to deal with them. 17:36, April 14, 2013 (UTC)

Mistranslation of 藤?
So.. 藤 seems to be translated as Wisteria here, which is not a color but a genus of plants. Wouldn't the color mauve/light purple (alternate translation for 藤) be more appropriate, in keeping with the admiral's epithet format of "color + animal"?175.141.50.74 18:23, April 17, 2013 (UTC)


 * Wisteria is used in Japan as a color, referring to "wisteria purple" specifically.--) 18:26, April 17, 2013 (UTC)

White/black justice
I think that it should be mentioned (here and in the chapter 713 page) about his white/black justice regarding Law. The casino roulette scene is an obvious reference to this too. RapidX (talk) 22:29, July 7, 2013 (UTC)

link plz-- 22:13, July 7, 2013 (UTC)

What the hell are you talking about? 22:20, July 7, 2013 (UTC)

I'm talking about what is in the actual raw, but mangapanda and mangastream decided to completely ignore that part so they worded it differently.

Here is from CCC translation of the chapter:

Fuji: “In regards to the reported matter of the Strawhat Crew…” “If indeed they have all allied, as the newspaper said, then Law is “black”!!” “But if they… if they have merely become your underlings, Law, then you are “white”!!”

RapidX (talk) 22:29, July 7, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah, that's the proper translation. We should include it. 22:54, July 7, 2013 (UTC)

I agree. WU out - 06:53, July 8, 2013 (UTC)

can anyone else confirm this-- 15:27, July 8, 2013 (UTC)

The words "black" and "white" are pretty clear in the RAW. There's nothing controversial about that.
 * 記事通り同盟なら" 黒 "‼
 * 彼らが…ローさん　あんたの部下になったのなら……" 白 "だ‼

But there hasn't been a line that says "Issho's justice is black and white justice" in the same way that the other admirals' ideas of justice have been expressly confirmed, so saying it in that way would be speculation. The line just makes it likely that his justice is something along those lines. 15:47, July 8, 2013 (UTC)

damn mangastream is just bad, people lets just disregards all that is posted by them and actually wait for better sources, like manga rule XD Doomroar (talk) 01:15, July 15, 2013 (UTC)

If I'm not wrong, the pre timeskip admiral's way of justice was stated in an SBS so i think it would be safe to wait for a same confirmation for the new ones too.For all we know this "black/white" line could be a common japanese expression meaning "cool/not cool" or "bad/good" or simply that Issho is a secret fan of Michael Jackson.Vazelos3 (talk) 07:13, July 15, 2013 (UTC)

Viz and Mangastream haven't "ignored" it -- they're actually translating it with knowledge of the Japanese language. In Japanese, if someone describes a crime as black, it means they're guilty; if they describe it as "white." they're innocent. Wikipedia describes it as police slang. It's not something unique to Issho or the world of One Piece. You can read about here and here Not sure if you guys are aware, but it's not always best to literally read Japanese, especially if you are unknowing of the language. XScar (talk) 09:59, July 15, 2013 (UTC)

Mangastream is awful. SeaTerror (talk) 10:48, July 15, 2013 (UTC)

Ok. I swear on my life that I will never read OP from Mangastream again.

I agree with Vazelos3 we should wait for more info to appear, as for Viz or Mangastream translations.... damn i think i just found an spy, because they do an awful work. Doomroar (talk) 17:36, July 15, 2013 (UTC)

Issho's Possible Devil Fruit
His Devil Fruit Powers could be a Paramecia, which is funny as both previous Admiral's were Logia types.

It may be a new or different Devil Fruit possibly something to do with Gravity and unlike the Fuwa Fuwa no Mi which cancels Gravity, it increases the intensity and force of Gravity by high degrees.

That would explain the pressure and force of which he inflicts onto others and the cause of giant holes in ships.

Magicman2419 (talk) 19:31, September 15, 2013 (UTC)

It is indeed possible, but the talk pages aren't a place for speculations and such. 19:32, September 15, 2013 (UTC)

Oh, I did not know that. I just thought that since it is a talk page then I could talk about some thing I was thinking about on Issho and clues that I noticed about him. Magicman2419 (talk) 19:35, September 15, 2013 (UTC)

You can talk about it in the forum or on a blog. SeaTerror (talk) 03:30, September 16, 2013 (UTC)

Devil Fruit sword
Isn't his Devil Fruit ability actually coming from his sword? He was holding it against Law to pin him down. 05:05, October 3, 2013 (UTC)

I don't remember seeing him using his sword to bring the Meteors down. Also, I think we should mention that his ability is gravity in the Devil Fruit section. 05:24, October 3, 2013 (UTC)

Come to think of it every time he used gravity he used his sword so yeah, we should mention it. 05:32, October 3, 2013 (UTC)

Wait, really? Let me check. 05:33, October 3, 2013 (UTC)

He uses it as a means of channeling. He did the same thing in the casino. 05:35, October 3, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah, you guys are right, my bad. Shouldn't we also mention that his df ability is controling gravity? 05:37, October 3, 2013 (UTC)

Sure. 14:12, October 3, 2013 (UTC)

I've mentioned this under the "weapons" section a long time ago. If you think it should be furtherly detailed, without the danger of speculation involved, go ahaid and add it under DF too.

So we shouldn't say the sword holds the power to manipulate gravity? He just channels the gravity via his blade? 02:39, October 5, 2013 (UTC)

Yes. We saw it come out of his whole body when he brought that meteor down. But to pin down Law he was pointing his sword at him. 03:24, October 5, 2013 (UTC)

In 724, when he makes the battleship fly he is not using the sword, which proves he doesn't need it for all techniques. 23:37, October 9, 2013 (UTC)

Perhaps we can't count this because it was an anime adaption, but in this most recent episode 643, he appears to release "waves" of purple rings from his body that manipulate gravity through a slash-and-resheathe of his sword. Maybe he doesn't always use these rings, or maybe it requires a certain intensity for them to visible. But either way, I believe his ability to manipulate gravity works in an attract-and-repel fashion, generated through slashes & sheathes of his sword. HanataSanchou (talk) 14:15, May 5, 2014 (UTC)

Kenbunshoku Haki
We should stat he has Kenbunshoku haki, since in 730, he was able to stop Zoro effortlessly, CoolJazzman (talk) 19:25, January 11, 2014 (UTC)

stopping zoro effortlessly isnt definite proof-- 19:26, January 11, 2014 (UTC)

The fact that he is blind should be proof enough though. He managed to see through DD's thugs moves in the casino, how else could this happen?

He is completely blind and is still Admiral strength. Two reasons there why we can assume it. The fighting while blind, and the "every Marine over VA has Haki" thing. Even though there's the default info there, it does need mentioning that he is able to use it instead of sight. 22:12, January 11, 2014 (UTC)

Speculation. SeaTerror (talk) 00:28, January 12, 2014 (UTC)

The loss of one sense strengthens the others. Issho's lack of sight means his hearing is much more sensitive than the average person's. He more than likely heard the attack coming. If you guys would stop and think, you'd realize that haki isn't the answer to freaking everything. 00:38, January 12, 2014 (UTC)

I would'nt be surprised if it turns out to be his Haki

Joekido (talk) 00:44, January 12, 2014 (UTC)

Well, we know he has to have Haki because he's higher than VA, but might as well drop it now.

00:53, January 12, 2014 (UTC)

He most likely knows it, but his other senses help him move. He may use that Haki when he fights someone super strong, and super fast. But he doesn't need it to live, millions of blind people don't need Haki to live.

01:00, January 12, 2014 (UTC)

Everyone has Haki, remember? XD 01:07, January 12, 2014 (UTC)

Common sense says he obviously has it, but there haven't been any instances that are unambiguously CoO. It doesn't help that "blind guy has superhuman senses" is such a common trope. The best evidence we have is that he could sense the movement of the clouds during Nami's fight with Jora, but we haven't been told if that's something CoO can do... 03:44, January 12, 2014 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure Rayleigh said CoO only applies to living things. 03:47, January 12, 2014 (UTC)

Rayleigh didn't say "only" in Chap 597, and if non-living things couldn't be sensed then that would apply to things like bullets and other projectiles, which doesn't seem to be the case. In any event it's a moot point - I agree that it's speculation for now, even if the chances of him not having CoO are roughly the same as those of "Sabo" being someone else. 04:25, January 12, 2014 (UTC)

Allusion to Alabasta
Perhaps it's simply a mistranslation in the version(s) that I'm looking at, but when talking to Doflamingo in Episode 667 and Chapter 735, Issho mentions that there was a pirate who tried to hijack a country the way that Doflamingo had, and had he succeeded, that country would have become comparable to the state of the present Dressrosa. Considering the fact that he was talking about abolishing the Shichibukai system as he mentioned that, is it not a valid assumption that he was referring to Crocodile's attempt to take over Alabasta, which never would have been permitted were it not for his Shichibukai status?

The Dreamer (talk) 23:41, October 26, 2014 (UTC)

It's certainly possible, and according to Viz's translation may be the case, but it'll be very difficult to prove. There have been other similar incidents of pirates trying to hijack countries, Lucci's mission when he was 13 being one example. It seems likely but we can't say anything definitive about it. 00:26, October 27, 2014 (UTC)


 * Nods.*  Fair enough.  We'll just have to wait until more information comes to the surface, then. The Dreamer (talk) 00:44, October 27, 2014 (UTC)

Gurabito
Something's bugging me about how we're listing the name of Issho's gravity-channeling technique. Now, I understand that Oda frequently gives techniques non-Japanese names by writing words in kana above kanji, thus we romanize them into English, Spanish, or what-have-you. However, this technique's name is written in hiragana, and while it's true that you can't form the word "Gurabito" with the kanji in the technique's name, Gurabito was apparently not written in katakana (グラビト), so to me it doesn't make sense that we're romanizing it into Gravito. Given that the Yami Yami no Mi also has a technique consisting of kanji with an irregular hiragana name - namely Kurouzo - that we're not romanizing into anything, I think there's some inconsistency in how we're dealing with this sort of thing, and given the conventions of romanization as far as I know of them, I say we change the name to Gurabito. Thoughts?--Xilinoc (talk) 11:51, February 23, 2015 (UTC)

Well, it's a pun, right? 刀, meaning sword, can be read as "tō". So it's gurabitō instead of gurabitī (gravity). Maybe "Gravito" is the best way to romanize it. 19:37, February 23, 2015 (UTC)

I think "Gravito" works fine. With Xil's example of "Kurouzu," the kanji says "dark water" while the hiragana (and perhaps the appearance of the technique) indicates it should be "black spiral." There's a conflict in meaning, which is why we can't easily romanize "Kurouzu." On the other hand, the kanji "gravity sword" matches up with the reading, since as Kage pointed out, the "to" is a pun. It is a bit odd that it's written in hiragana instead of katakana, I'm not too sure what to make of that. MizuakiYume (talk) 03:40, March 6, 2015 (UTC)

^what kage and mizu said. 04:46, March 8, 2015 (UTC)

Trivia Wars
So some trivia have been removed by me, which prompted an edit war. The two said trivia are listed below:
 * "He is the first new admiral to be introduced after the timeskip."
 * "Fujitora is the first known Admiral to have a Paramecia class Devil Fruit."

I'm comfortable with keeping both trivia if the majority is for keeping them but personally, I do not think we should keep the second one. A lot of people have Paramecia class DFs, why make it a big deal for Issho, just because the other admirals have Logia fruits? That's a bit like saying Chopper is the only Zoan user in the Straw Hat Pirates, or Crocodile is the only Logia user in the Baroque Works. 21:56, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

We should scrap the first one, which is painfully obvious, but I think we should keep the second one. It's a fun fact, even though it is kinda obvious. 22:03, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

The first one is completely useless. There's only two new admirals, why does it matter that Fujitora happened to appear first? Regarding the second one, maybe it'd be worth including once his DF is actually fully explained. It's still stating the obvious, though. 22:11, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, the second trivia is basically useless, since it's just stating the obvious that he is a Paramecia DF user. The first one is even more useless, since it's also stating the quite very obvious fact. 22:23, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

The 2nd one is more valid than the first one. The original 3 admirals names, colors, and I think powers all came from the Japanese legend SeaTerror (talk) 22:27, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

Get rid of the first one. For the second one, Sengoku was the first admiral known to have a Zoan, and it's not on his page. So why should Issho have it? 22:37, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

Only the animal part of their aliases come from a Japanese legend, ST. 22:39, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

My suggestion would be to list ALL the ways that Fujitora broke pattern. But, as Aurororanoa pointed out, Sengoku broke pattern, too, so I don't think it's worthy at all. 22:46, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

Ryu's idea is better. Plus there's no evidence Sengoku had his Zoan powers when he was an admiral anyway. SeaTerror (talk) 22:55, February 24, 2015 (UTC)

Agreed with Jade. --&#34;The good mean well. We just don&#39;t always end up doing well.&#34; ~ Isaac (talk) 01:15, February 25, 2015 (UTC)

Both trivia are pattern brokers, but not worthy enough. After all, there are too many of these minor pattern broker trivia out there, and we don't list every one of them. 02:51, February 25, 2015 (UTC)
 * Heck, I suggest we hunt down these trivia, and remove any that are not significant enough. 02:52, February 25, 2015 (UTC)

"Minor" SeaTerror (talk) 04:08, February 25, 2015 (UTC)

I was gonna say keep the second (the first one is essentially mentioned already in the article), but then I read Ryu's post. I would say trash it, or also add trivia to Sengoku's page that would be highly speculative. Oh wait, "highly" speculative means we shouldn't have it. Trash em both. 06:47, February 25, 2015 (UTC)

"Plus there's no evidence Sengoku had his Zoan powers when he was an admiral anyway" SeaTerror (talk) 10:20, February 25, 2015 (UTC)

All for removing the first trivia, only one is against removing the second trivia, so I'm calling a clear majority. 21:10, February 25, 2015 (UTC)