Talk:Straw Hat Pirates

Kozuki Clan/Mokomo Dukedom in Allies Section
Shouldn't we put the Kozuki clan in the ally section like it is on the Heart Pirates, instead of every single person individually. Seems counterintuitive. Ddog892 (talk) 23:01, March 10, 2016 (UTC)

I have to agree. If all the members work for the Kozuki Family (in this case, Momonosuke), then it can be shortened up to to the Kozuki Family. KingCannon (talk) 23:18, March 10, 2016 (UTC)

Well of course, we should do that.

Joekido (talk) 00:14, March 11, 2016 (UTC)

Individual characters seems like a no-no. But do we include the whole Mokomo Dukedom as a part of the "Kozuki Clan", or are they separate entities? 01:34, March 15, 2016 (UTC)


 * Asking the correct question, JSD! We definitely shouldn't add individual characters, not when they're all part of the same organization. But exactly which organization they belong to is the question. I think going with the "Kozuki Clan" is the safer bet for now, so let's go with it. 03:05, March 17, 2016 (UTC)

On second thought, it's called the "Ninja-Mink-Pirate alliance", I think we should consider the minks separately. 11:39, March 18, 2016 (UTC)

That could be redundant considering that the Mink leaders are already retainers of the Kozuki Family.

One could argue that because the entire tribe is under Inuarashi and Nekomamushi, they're in a way subservient to the Kozuki Family despite not being retainers. Chapter 815 showed this well, with every mink kneeling down.

This is basic organization. The subordinate of the subordinate of the boss is still a subordinate of the boss. KingCannon (talk) 01:56, March 19, 2016 (UTC)

Yes, but the forces they represent are still vastly different. One is a family in one country, the other is the entire force of a country. They both get their names directly mentioned in the alliance by Luffy, I think they should be both represented separately in the gallery. Let the article explain why the alliance between them exists. 18:14, March 24, 2016 (UTC)

We probably shouldn't base our articles on the stupid names Luffy utters once in a while, though I still agree that both the 'dukedom' and Kozuki retainers should be counted as different entities. Just for simplicity's sake. 18:21, March 24, 2016 (UTC)

The alliance in the manga clearly views the Minks as separated from the Kozuki Family. "Ninja-Mink-Pirate" Alliance, hello? So we should view the Kozuki Family and the Minks as two entirely different entities. In that case, let them be represented separately in the gallery as JSD said. 18:24, March 24, 2016 (UTC)

It is now formatted correctly. 17:54, May 31, 2016 (UTC)

no Ichimi
Doesn't "Mugiwara no Ichimi" mean Straw Hat Crew and not Pirates? Does the Japanese need to be changed to match Straw Hat Pirates? Meshack (talk) 02:16, January 13, 2017 (UTC)

They are "Mugiwara no Ichimi". They have not been called "Mugiwara Kaizokudan" in the manga. --Klobis (talk) 02:00, February 17, 2017 (UTC)

So should we change the name to "Straw Hat Crew"? Meshack (talk) 12:56, February 17, 2017 (UTC)

Nah, it means basically the same thing and every official translation calls them the Straw Hat Pirates. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 16:57, February 17, 2017 (UTC)

I didn't know official translations influence the way this wiki works Meshack (talk) 02:33, February 21, 2017 (UTC)

They can help when we're considering a term that is pretty much the same as the one for every other pirate crew in the series.

Why are you being stubborn about this? Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 02:36, February 21, 2017 (UTC)

I was just asking but Klobis said they were never referred to as Mugiwara no Kaizokudan in the manga so why have the name of the page this? Meshack (talk) 02:54, February 21, 2017 (UTC)

That's odd, first few examples I checked in official translation had it as Straw Hat Crew (Chapter 796, Chapter 803, twice in Chapter 806, Chapter 846, Chapter 850). At the very least it's inconsistent. But it's also been romanized as 'Straw Hat Crew' in the Japanese character introduction pages of the volumes for 25 volumes now. 107.6.84.228 09:52, February 21, 2017 (UTC)

Yeah. In the Japanese version of the manga, the name of the group is romanized "Straw Hat Crew" Meshack (talk) 13:09, February 21, 2017 (UTC)

So... is the change going to be taken into consideration? Meshack (talk) 13:44, March 10, 2017 (UTC)

It's better to be consistent with every other pirate crew then make the exception here. We have more things on the wiki that aren't translated literally. Besides, the term has been used for soooo long, does it really matter? 16:41, March 10, 2017 (UTC)

Part 2
I still think the page should be Straw Hat Crew rather than Straw Hat Pirates. Oda writes the name as Straw Hat Crew so this page should be written that way like others Meshack (talk) 03:58, July 1, 2017 (UTC)

Dude, starting the same conversation without anything new happening isn't gonna get you anywhere Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 04:48, July 1, 2017 (UTC)

Agreed. This was discussed already. Unless you have something new to bring to the topic, it's not getting reopened any time soon.

10:37, July 1, 2017 (UTC)

I'm bringing this up again because it bothers me that this wiki uses spellings by Oda but completely ignores the Straw Hat Crew spelling and chooses Straw Hat Pirates over it. Again, the Japanese for the two terms are different so I don't see why you guys aren't changing it to Straw Hat Crew Meshack (talk) 02:25, July 11, 2017 (UTC)

Where is it romanized as such? Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 02:30, July 11, 2017 (UTC)

Everywhere. Here's an example. It's in all of the volumes and even in the ONE PIECE magazine. Meshack (talk) 02:54, July 11, 2017 (UTC)

They have also been reffered to as. You can go on about that the CP9 image is older than the volume introduction page, but what we should be looking for is a compromise. Does the fact that they are always referred to as Straw Hat Crew be relevant against the naming system every other pirate crew has? Is there even a distinct difference between crew and pirates in figurative sense? My suggestion is to change the phrase in the introduction to "mainly referred to as the Straw Hat Crew" and leave it as Pirates. 08:50, July 14, 2017 (UTC)

Whenever "ichimi" has been used in the series so far, it has referred to pirates. We don't have any examples of the crew of, for example, a cruise ship being referred to/named as "ichimi". There's that understanding that though they might say "crew", they are talking about pirates. I see no problem with leaving the page name as it is. MizuakiYume (talk) 09:21, July 14, 2017 (UTC)

@AuroraOfDeath Horrible example unless you're also suggesting to change Straw Hat to Mugiwara. Ichimi can mean "crew," not pirates. Kaizoukudan can means "pirates" Meshack (talk) 03:57, August 12, 2017 (UTC)

I learnt it from the master of bringing up horrible examples: you. Now, do you refuse or not refuse that they have been referred to as both, since you never explained? I acknowledge that they have only been referred to as a crew, but the discussion doesn't end there, so please stop repeating that. My request is that you reply to the things brought upon the table by me and MizuakiYume. I know it's hard for you to consider counter-arguments, but please try. Thank you. 12:09, August 12, 2017 (UTC)

They are pirates but that doesn't change what I said. Meshack (talk) 20:09, August 12, 2017 (UTC)

For the sake of consistency, we're leaving it as pirates. Crew is simply a more casual term given the reader's familiarity with the group. Six of one, half a dozen of the other. 20:41, August 13, 2017 (UTC)

Leave it as pirates 01:44, September 8, 2017 (UTC)

Leave as pirates and this discussion is over. 22:54, September 30, 2017 (UTC)

Part Three-general naming
After going through several covers for a different reason and saw that they are romanized as "Mugiwara Pirates" (File:Chapter 357.png, File:Chapter 377.png, File:Chapter 756.png, File:Chapter 872.png). Rhavkin (talk) 07:50, January 11, 2018 (UTC)

Jinbe
With chapter 863, Jinbe has left the Big Mom Pirates with intentions of joining the Straw Hats. Should he be considered an official member now because of how welcoming the Straw Hats are towards him? It hasn't been 100% outright stated but I think all things considered it's guaranteed. Ecylisis (talk) 15:07, April 20, 2017 (UTC)


 * He specifically left the Big Mom Pirates because he was joining the Straw Hat Crew. He did leave but I don't think he's part of the crew yet Meshack (talk) 15:49, April 20, 2017 (UTC)

He's all ready to join now and intends to do so, but he did not join yet. 16:08, April 20, 2017 (UTC)

Lets just wait for a few more chapters coz who knows... Jinbe might die in the nexe chapter.

He Has Joined STRAWHATS he dies or not, he is now offiical memeber of Strawhats. so add him in the list  11:23, May 22, 2017 (UTC) VickyDluffy (talk)

I want to add that Luffy did ask Jinbe to join the crew back on fisherman island, so this is not one sided from just Jinbe wanting to join. It's a mutual thing from both the crew and Jinbe, so please do update. LlVIU (talk) 23:44, May 27, 2017 (UTC)

Vivi was asked and ponder whether or not to go. Wait until the end of the arc, shouldn't be long now. Rhavkin (talk) 23:50, May 27, 2017 (UTC)

No. Wait for full confirmation i.e. the end of the arc like Rhav said. 04:01, May 28, 2017 (UTC)

With the latest chapter, it's looking much more like a confirmation that Jinbe can be considered as part of the crew no? He basically just fell perfectly into his role as a helmsman, a position the crew has always lacked, which has always been indicated to be a role Jine was meant to fulfil. Not to mention, he just saved the crew's lives while fulfiling that position. Woohoot (talk) 00:10, October 6, 2017 (UTC)

I agree, that we can count Jinbe as the helmsman of the Strawhats from here on. He is called like that when they escape Big Moms wave and he did not just announce it to Big Mom and Ruffy but also to his old crew, the Sun Pirates. Bobowm (talk) 17:56, November 25, 2017 (UTC)

Jinbe/straw hats
Shouldn't Jinbe be affiliated with the straw hat pirates ?Strawhat Idriss (talk) 01:27, June 12, 2017 (UTC)

Jimbe seems like he's going to join but I haven't read the magna lately so I don't know if it's official yet. It seems like he's going to at the end of the Whole Cake Island arc unless he gets killed Shadowneko (talk) 02:25, June 26, 2017 (UTC)

Why aren't the germa 66 or the vinsmoke family listed under ally for the straw hat pirates  but the Germa  66 is listed under the firetank pirates To love this (talk) 02:13, August 11, 2017 (UTC)

Jinbe as a Member of the Straw Hat Pirates
Hey I think Jinbe shouldn't be consider a members of the Straw Hats just yet after He makes proper farewell to the Sun Pirates and to me He didn't properly join the crew because He stay behind to ensure his other crew survival until then I think we should wait until he properly consider as a member of the Straw Hat

Cdswalkthrough (talk) 16:34, April 13, 2018 (UTC)

Yes, definitely. Luffy told Jinbe he was his captain, meaning Jinbe joined the crew. 20:12, April 13, 2018 (UTC)

Sorry I forgot to add some thing on what I said But I don't think Jinbe is officially a member of the Straw Hat untill he appear in Wano and make proper farewell to his other crew and just because Luffy said he is now Jinbe captain doesn't mean He officially a member as Jinbe stay behind to ensure the survival of his old crew the Sun Pirates

Cdswalkthrough (talk) 07:40, April 14, 2018 (UTC)

Yes, Luffy saying Jinbe is a member officially makes him a member. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 13:55, April 14, 2018 (UTC)

Um did you not properly read on what I just said I said I don't think Jinbe is a Straw Hat members yet as he stay behind to ensure his old crew survival and Luffy saying that he is now Jinbe's captain isn't going to cut it Cdswalkthrough (talk) 15:35, April 14, 2018 (UTC)CdswalkthroughCdswalkthrough (talk) 15:35, April 14, 2018 (UTC)

He read what you said. He just disagrees, as do I. Jinbe is part of the crew. 15:40, April 14, 2018 (UTC)

No Considering that Jinbe stayed behind to save his old crew doesn't make him officialy a member If Oda officially consider Jinbe a member or Jinbe arrived at Wano after saving his old crew and Jinbe properly ask Luffy to join his crew that is when He should be consider a official member Cdswalkthrough (talk) 15:48, April 14, 2018 (UTC)CdswalkthroughCdswalkthrough (talk) 15:48, April 14, 2018 (UTC)

Why demand those specific situations? Luffy stated that he is Jinbe's captain. This makes Jinbe a Straw Hat, regardless of his current situation. No way to say otherwise except completely making up requirements that Oda has never used as a standard. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 16:10, April 14, 2018 (UTC)

Because I feel he shouldn't be consider as a Straw Hat just yet and Luffy stating that he is now Jinbe's captain isn't enough to consider him a member until he resolve his current situation He shouldn't be consider as a Straw Hat Cdswalkthrough (talk) 17:37, April 14, 2018 (UTC)cdswalkthroughCdswalkthrough (talk) 17:37, April 14, 2018 (UTC)

There was a discution on Jinbe's talk page about him being a member since chapter 863, but it was decided to not consider him a member until Luffy said it, and now he did. We should this and future case of possible members on each character talk page so we'll have everything in the same place. 176.12.210.20 17:43, April 14, 2018 (UTC)

"Why demand those specific situations? Luffy stated that he is Jinbe's captain." Because anything can happen in between. SeaTerror (talk) 17:53, April 14, 2018 (UTC)

Jinbe joining another group (not gonna happen) or dying (even less likely) would not change the fact that to Luffy, he is a Straw Hat throughout everything that happens in between Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 19:35, April 14, 2018 (UTC)

Jinbe didn't stay behind simply to protect the Sun Pirates. He asks Luffy (a proof he considers Luffy his superior) to stay behind explaining he will protect the rear guard along with the Sun Pirates to make sure the Sunny will be able to flee the Queen Mama Chanter. He is trying to protect his old crew, but ultimately he is doing it, and that's the official reason he gives, to protect the Strawhats (and even if it was just to protect his old crew, it wouldn't mean anything. He is allowed to protect other people even if he is a Strawhat). As said above, nothing that happens will erase what we saw this chapter: Luffy stating he is Jinbe's captain and Jinbe treating Luffy as his captain by asking for his permission. The captain considers him a member of the crew and he considers himself a member of the crew, even if he dies one minute after that he will die as a member of the Strawhat Pirates. - Gorenja (talk) 03:44, April 15, 2018 (UTC)

There's no point spending all this time bickering when there's a color spread in a few days. Whether Jinbe's on it or not should provide a better answer at this point in time. 45.56.153.136 04:03, April 15, 2018 (UTC)

Profession
Jinbe was never stated to be the Straw Hat's official helmsman so its wrong to list it as the profession. SeaTerror (talk) 16:09, April 16, 2018 (UTC)

I agree with the listing. He acts as helmsman (at least he did while escaping Big Mom) and Nami said: "I've never seen a helmsman like that." (chapter 881) thus stating that it is his profession or at least his speciality and since the strawhats don't have one yet it is pretty safe to say Jinbe now holds the title. But I see your point as well, don't get me wrong. --Bobowm (talk) 16:25, April 16, 2018 (UTC)

Jinbe's main profession is clearly helmsmanship so I think it can stay. Stating he's the Straw Hats' official helmsman is another matter. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 16:45, April 16, 2018 (UTC)

It states he's the official helmsman in the table since that's for the actual crew jobs. SeaTerror (talk) 16:49, April 16, 2018 (UTC)

The word "official" isn't amywhere on the table. Rhavkin (talk) 17:00, April 16, 2018 (UTC)

"Professions and Capabilities" but if you want to add unofficial jobs you might as well First Mate under Zoro's profession. SeaTerror (talk) 17:03, April 16, 2018 (UTC)

That's speculation. Rhavkin (talk) 17:05, April 16, 2018 (UTC)

Thank you for agreeing then. SeaTerror (talk) 17:22, April 16, 2018 (UTC)

Zoro never acted as First Mate. Actually most of the times Nami takes on command when Ruffy is not there. Jinbe on the other hand actually acted as a helmsman, but I do see the point Kaido King of the Beasts makes, although I have to add, that other activities of strawhat members are listed as Professions as well, since it was never stated (at least not that I can recall) that Robin is the archeologist of the crew. Edit: Since SeaTerror wrote while I was still typing the edit was overwritten by mine, so I readded it. --Bobowm (talk) 17:22, April 16, 2018 (UTC)

I didn't agreed, I'm saing Zoro is a different case. Rhavkin (talk) 17:41, April 16, 2018 (UTC)

It's the same situation since it was never stated anywhere that he's the official helmsman of the Straw Hats. SeaTerror (talk) 03:55, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

He got the directions from Nami the confirmed navigator and sail the ship. He has skills in maneuvering a ship in various conditions. He is a helmsman and a member of the Straw Hats. The straw Hats each have a profession they specialize in, regardless of other abilities (Usopp's crafts or Franky's ukulele playing). You're just being your regular anal self. Jinbe is the Straw Hats helmsman until proven otherwise. Rhavkin (talk) 06:33, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

Every single member was actually called their job at one point. Jinbe wasn't. Unless you can find the chapter that doesn't exist where Luffy called him the Straw Hat Pirate's helmsman. SeaTerror (talk) 10:52, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

While I agree that they should be explicitly mentioned to be of that profession for the crew (just the same as Brook is the Musician instead of both Musician and Swordsman), I think we could include Jinbe's profession in there with a disclaimer pointing that it is implicit rather than explicit. We can make such judgements based on precedent: each member has a profession, that profession is sufficiently obvious, only that person can be representative of that profession. Unless we could try and find a reference for each moment when a crewmember was explicitly declared their profession, which would also be fair.

It would be better to reference them all but that could work too. SeaTerror (talk) 18:58, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

Zeus
So zeus is consider a crew member rightTo love this (talk) 03:56, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

I don't actually see why Zeus should be; he wasn't considered one of the Big Mom Pirates, he was lumped in with the homies. He's a tool, and Nami indicates she's going to be using him that way.--Rrmcklin (talk) 04:35, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

Wait what that makes no since homies are considered members of big mama piratesTo love this (talk) 16:35, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

It is utterly, utterly ridiculous that any one would consider Zeus as an equal member to the others. He is viewed as nothing but a tool--not in any way, shape, or form is he viewed by the others as a friend/comrade/crewmember. Ddog892 (talk) 05:06, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

So by that way of thinking spandam elephant sword, lasso, the zombies of thriller bark all shoul not be co sider crew memebers of there orginaztionsTo love this (talk) 16:35, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

I think it's better to see him as an ally. Currently he is only a weapon, like the Franky Shogun. --Cdavymatias (talk) 10:38, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

But zeus is alive franky shogun is not To love this (talk) 16:35, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

Yeah, he should not be listed as a regular crewmember. 10:40, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

He should be he aliveTo love this (talk) 16:35, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

But the wiki counts Funkfreed and Lasso as members of their respective groups, and they're just living weapons too. And Stronger is just a beast of burden yet he's a member of his crew. And Hattori is just a pet. At the very least a new subheader should be made reading "subordinates" or "slaves" for Zeus to be added in since "allies" should be more for those who are tied to the crew but not directly subservient to them or with them 24/7, unlike Zeus who lives with them now and is basically Nami's slave, so they practically own him. --SpikeDragonLord (talk) 15:36, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

He should be consider a a crew memember To love this (talk) 16:35, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

I know the addition of a Straw Hat member is always a big thing and that wasn't the case for Zeus, but we do put guys like Stronger and Funkfreed alongside their groups so I don't see why not to do it with Zeus. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 16:38, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

Exactly, same for Lasso and Smiley who are also listed as members of their organizations. Zeus himself was just Big Mom's weapon and he even counted as a member of her crew. Like I said before, at the very least make a new subheader for subordinates or slaves instead of dumping him in allies. --SpikeDragonLord (talk) 16:43, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

We wait to see if in future manga volumes he appears among the crew in the character descriptions? --Cdavymatias (talk) 18:30, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

Unless he gets an actual number or anything stating he's a proper crew member, he belongs in another section. I don't care which one. 18:46, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

That sounds very fair. Maybe one that reads "slaves", "subordinates" or "servants" like some other crews have. --SpikeDragonLord (talk) 18:50, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

He should be under a weapon section. He is obviously not a member of the crew since Luffy never asked him to join like everybody else. SeaTerror (talk) 18:56, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

He's referred to as a "slave/servant". Not a weapon. So the subheader for Zeus should be servants or slaves. --SpikeDragonLord (talk) 19:12, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

He was only ever called that in comedic scenes. SeaTerror (talk) 19:31, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

Until Luffy has not been seen as his captain, as he did with Jinbe, he is not a member. Currently he accompanies Nami, but at any moment he can return with Linlin in a future story arc. Currently he is only a weapon in the clima tact, not a member of the crew. --Cdavymatias (talk) 19:43, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

It was not said in the comedic sense when Nami first captured him in his shrunken form and threatened his life. He clearly should be marked under servant rather than weapon. --SpikeDragonLord (talk) 20:49, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

Actually it was. SeaTerror (talk) 22:47, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

For the record, I don't think that Stronger or Funkfreed should be considered full-fledged members of any groups their respective owners belong to either. That's always struck me as strange.--Rrmcklin (talk) 03:16, April 29, 2018 (UTC)

Zeus is just like smiley frunkfreed stronger and lasso they are some one wea0ons or tools.but listed as crew.memebers so he should be considered   the 11 memember and listed as it or.very least be consider lile the thousand sunny and merry is To love this (talk) 06:27, April 29, 2018 (UTC)