Talk:Charlotte Linlin

Question
Is Big Mom even a real character? 09MurphyM 03:26, April 13, 2010 (UTC)

It's not certain yet but apparently she's the final Yonkou


 * She was named as the final Emperor in an unconfirmed bit of spoiler text for chapter 581. Unlike usual, we don't even have confirmation from any of the usual sources that this spoiler is even close to legitimate, as well as not having any pictures to go along with it whatsoever.
 * It may very well end up being true, but until the full chapter comes out, we can't confirm it and it's against the rules of the wikia to post spoiler information anyway. So, short answer is: We don't know yet, maybe. So don't add anything on this character, at least not yet. DemonRin 15:10, April 13, 2010 (UTC)

She's totally Lola's mom, the famous pirate in the New World. Makes perfect sense and there's a mild resemblance.

she probably is lola's mum but i reckon its possible it could be a title like how the whitebeard pirates call whitebeard dad and that lola is just an ally of the big mum pirates Jimmy recard 09:10, April 15, 2010 (UTC)

actually thats to boring nvm she's her actual mum Jimmy recard 09:11, April 15, 2010 (UTC)

Well the chapter is out and she's confirmed

Joekido 19:46, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

the chapter is confirmed i just read it at www.mangastream.com and the final emperor is named by kidd.

Considering the name, I think that she must be the sillouette with the blushed cheeks in the 4 sillouetes picture where the yonkou are metnioned by garp (the top sillouette on the current pic on the kaidou page)

Sex
It hasn't been confirmed but i think we should refer to Big Mum as a she for now if that's ok.I don't think we will see a tranvestite stronger than Ivankov.UsoppSpell 20:00, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

It's possible Big Mum is an okama but considering the theory that she's lola's mum I think she probably wont be.

from the name i thinks big mam is a woman!!!!  Nico ❤❤❤  00:22, November 15, 2012 (UTC)

Romanization
Just a note: the name from the raw is, in katakana, ビッグ・マム Biggu Mamu. To me, it sounds like it should be "Big Mom", but maybe that's just my American English bias. Daisekihan 19:56, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

I think it should be either Big Mam or Big Mum due to the fact that if it were Big Mom, oda would have written it as ビッグ・モム ''Biggu Momu. Pharap 20:20, April 16, 2010 (UTC)''

Several things not to do
First, we cannot be sure of the gender even from the name/nickname. What if the person is an okama or just flamboyant or people just asume they are female ? There are a lot of possibilities so it's best not to speculate.

The same goes for writing "some fans speculate she is Lola's mother". This should absolutely not go into an article, for crissake. --New Babylon 20:15, April 14, 2010 (UTC)


 * Properly not Okama, but at this stage anythings possible. I doubt its Okama because Ivankov is pretty much king and all and I doubt someone stronger then him/her would be introduced. This will properly make moresense to me though tomorrow... One-Winged Hawk 22:41, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

Name
Is it Big Mum or Big Mom??Please pick one and stop changing it!!UsoppSpell 20:32, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

For now we should probably just go with "Mom". The only sub up so far is Mangastream; and while it's good for getting the gist of the chapter, then exact translations are usually a bit different from what it has. So until we have a few more subs up, let's use the more common "Mom" instead of "Mum". If worst comes to worst, is it really all that hard to change?Gerokeymaster 20:53, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

Btw do we know if Big Mom is his/her name or nickname?Kidd used Shank's nickname and Kaidou's name when he was talking about the Yonkou.UsoppSpell 20:49, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

It's almost certainly a nickname. Kaidou may not have a nickname, and Kidd uses Shanks's, Whitebeard's, and Blackbeard's nicknames in the same conversation. Anyway, like everyone is saying, let's just wait, and not jump to any conclusions. They'll be formally introduced soon enough...Gerokeymaster 20:53, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

We do NOT know which one of the two it is
So do not act as if we do. --New Babylon 20:41, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

Yah, better to leave the version of the picture with both faces up...Gerokeymaster 20:50, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

Yeah they both look ugly anyway ^^ UsoppSpell 20:51, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

Can someone who knows how resize the profile pic so it's not squished all onto the right side? I'd do it but I'm afraid I'll screw it up worse...Gerokeymaster 21:01, April 14, 2010 (UTC)


 * Well it's good the way it is for now . Let's wait and see if some over zealous contributors don't revert everything I've reverted back before bothering about trivialities . --New Babylon 21:09, April 14, 2010 (UTC)


 * Its properly the one their saying it is... I'd like to see a phyical appearance though before we declare it possible. One-Winged Hawk 22:39, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

Easier Pronoun
Instead of using he/she, him/her, and all that, would it be easier to just use they, their, etc., until we know the gender. It makes it a bit less confusing in my opinion, but I won't change it unless some other people think it's a good idea, too...Gerokeymaster 21:33, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

they?why use they when u r talking about one person?well maybe he/she(:P) has a split personality but thats just speculation(actually it is a joke)UsoppSpell 21:35, April 14, 2010 (UTC)


 * That is quite gramaticaly incorent . Plus "him/her" is a legitimate and well used form of either refering to several people or to someone whose gender you do not know . --New Babylon 21:40, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

Image
Okay, this is getting ridiculous. Tipota and I are having an edit war between the two images of the remaining Yonkou.



Between these two, we know that one is a man and one is a woman. All speculation aside, it just takes a bit of common bloody sense to tell which is which. While the top could be a man, considering Kaidou is an okama (but considering Ivankov is their king, and they wouldn't introduce one more powerful than him, that's unlikely), it is absolutely impossible for the bottom one to be a female. Whether you want to use your common sense or not on that one, you just have to look at Oda's art style to realize that women don't look like that.

So can we please come to a decision here?

What do we do with the images of Kaidou and Big Mom on their respective articles? Have both pages show both; it can't be determined who is who yet. Show the male one on Kaidou's page and the female one on Big Mom's page; it's easy enough to tell who is who. The Pope 15:09, April 15, 2010 (UTC)
 * It would be better to have the two image one and then have this page locked for further editing... We can't add anything else, we've just got a name. So for now, get the two face image back on the page and lock the page until a chapter comes out with more info. One-Winged Hawk 15:12, April 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * It would be better not to include an image until we've resolved this issue at all! So I removed it. Now, lets stop the edit wars and lets all discuss this formally and stop bickering like children over what should and shouldn't be here. One-Winged Hawk 16:27, April 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * Pope, let me tell you this : using "common sense" does not equal confirmation . Furthermore women look neither like Lola , nor like Kokoro , but in OP they do . So please don't say "it has to be that one , even without any confirmation , because this partialy revealed silhouete , acording to my common sense , cannot match the other partialy seen silhouete in how un womanly it is" . We know it is one of the two so we may use the image of both , but resolving ourselves will not have any meaning for the canon of the series.


 * We have no confirmation, voting on what we want to be true will not make it true . --New Babylon 16:30, April 15, 2010 (UTC)

We must show both of them or none at all because they might end up looking nothing like that much like the shichibukai silhouette during yosaku's explanationUsoppSpell 16:37, April 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * I'll second that. Mostly because being sick today I'm a little bit on the grumpy side that we've had 70+ edits to an article thats less then a week old and only has 3 or so bits of info. -_- One-Winged Hawk 16:39, April 15, 2010 (UTC)

Also if we are to remove the image here the same thing must be done for kaidou's article UsoppSpell 16:41, April 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * It will likely end up the same way. One-Winged Hawk 16:43, April 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * Oh we have to show the image . This is not like a silhouete of the shichibukai, these are more or less direct facials with only some parts missing . But they stil don't reveal the gender of the person . Oh and by the way , I would admit to include one of the other was shown to have a beard.....but the thing is even some women have facial hair and by that I mean seizable beards . :P --New Babylon 16:43, April 15, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well if we really have to show an image them we should use the one showing both of them and then lock this article we all dedicated more than enough time for such a small article we could do a bunch of other stuff like add images for the supernovae's ships or something like that UsoppSpell 16:51, April 15, 2010 (UTC)

I still think that it's pretty obvious which is which. Women are drawn to be more round, while men are more angular. Women never have that kind of grin that Kaidou has. Like I said, while it's debatable the gender of the poofy-haired one, it's pretty clear that the other is male. The Pope 18:27, April 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * No Pope, it's not obvious . Until Oda confirms it , nothing can be considered a fact . --New Babylon 18:40, April 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * I guess that's true...but is it really a good enough solution to just put both? Or should we have no image at all? The Pope 18:43, April 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * So far the vote is majority for both images. Looks like if a picture is entered that may be the direction we go for both articles. I wish I could say more, but I've run out of brain juice for today... One-Winged Hawk 18:50, April 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * I'm just gonna add that while one looks like he has mustache, it really isn't 100% clear that the other one is Big Mom. To a certain degree, both look like males and the mustache of one guy looks almost like a shadow. There's also the little matter of Big Mom's name sounding like an epithet like Whitebeard or Red hair. It maybe speculative but it wouldn't be surprising if it is revealed that Big Mom is an Okama with a mustache considering with how Oda works. Not the best of theories but it does raises a thought. In any case, best to have the pic showing both than having none. We know it's one of them just not sure which one.Mugiwara Franky 02:40, April 16, 2010 (UTC)
 * The Left is Big Mom, the Right is Kaidou. Juraquille 12:39, September 11, 2010
 * The Left is Big Mom, the Right is Kaidou. Juraquille 12:39, September 11, 2010

Lock Please?
Well theres a edit war and we've just got two or three bits of info... Can we have the two person image restored to the page and then with all things checked out to be alright, lock the page to stop further wars until more info is out? Kaidou's page might also need this. One-Winged Hawk 15:13, April 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * Let's wait until we get more than just two or three people making their input into the matter. The Pope 15:18, April 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * Considering the number of edits ultimately reverted... Seriously, lets make up our minds on the image situation and lock the page! One-Winged Hawk 15:51, April 16, 2010 (UTC)

A list of "Not to do"
I think that at present we should include a warning into the article not to edit, add the following things :

--New Babylon 16:35, April 15, 2010 (UTC)
 * 1) The gender
 * 2) Which of the two sihlouetes it is
 * 3) Being Lola's mother/any reference to Lola

Whitebeard War?
Big mom is the only yonkou not shown to take part in the whitebeard war can we add it to the trivia?Biropg 17:08, April 16, 2010 (UTC)

Kaidou didnt take part either he only tried to stop whitebeard but he was intercepted by Shanks.Also Shanks didnt exactly take part he just went to stop the war(and he did so without using force).UsoppSpell 17:10, April 16, 2010 (UTC)


 * Ironically I added something today to the Trivia Guidelines and this falls under question 3 - pointing out the obivous. Basically, I think from the lack of information, one can draw a conclusion she hasn't really been involved with the storyline at all. One-Winged Hawk 17:12, April 16, 2010 (UTC)

And so the edits continue
Okay, someone has once again changed most of the references to "hers" and "herselves". I had the efrontery, being one of the seniors here , to put this into the page to dissuade people from continuing.

edited

Hope it works. --New Babylon 20:35, April 20, 2010 (UTC)

That mentions Makugai, you know? Isn't it supposed to be about edits for Big Mom? Subrosian 20:55, April 20, 2010 (UTC)


 * Yeah, this is the thing copied into the article , I just used Makugai's note and modified it , but it didn't copy it when I pressed "copy" for some reason ? :P Here is what is actualy in the article

--New Babylon 21:13, April 20, 2010 (UTC)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stilwell,_Oklahoma


 * Care to explain the legitimacy of a city in Oklahoma in this discusion, 69.226.35.87 ? -_-
 * --New Babylon 12:25, April 22, 2010 (UTC)

So about the pictures
Can we put them back up we know it's one of the two and people seem to have cooled down by now. --New Babylon 22:57, July 25, 2010 (UTC)

I agree, It's been a bit and everyone seems to have calmed down. Even if it turns out that the top one is Kaidou it wont really matter. So I say we should put the pics back up. - Copper5

Sorry, But Another Name Topic
How do we know that there wasn't another 'a' behind Pappug's head when it wrote "Big Mam"? It makes more sense with "Mama" rather than "Mam" anyway. I'm not saying to switch to "Mama", but don't rule it out. Ryuzakiforever 22:31, January 12, 2011 (UTC)

The Romanization makes it look like it's mam, and not mama, though I thought the same thing. It's like the problem we had with Eustass Kid. We all thought there was a second D that was cut off ( like the real pirate spelled it) when really it wasn't there at all. There would have been at least a hint of an A if the jolly roger was blocking it.DancePowderer 05:55, January 13, 2011 (UTC)

Look at how Basil Hawkins's name is written in chapte 498. Part of the H and N are cut off but you can still tell what they are. Or X. Drake in the same chapter, only the tips of the E are visible, but the translation makes it apparent.DancePowderer 06:03, January 13, 2011 (UTC)


 * Yes, but you should also consider the form of those letters: 'H', 'N' and 'E' ocuppy the top-left corner of a square, while a capital 'A' does not. So I say it's still too early to rule out the possibility of another 'A' being on her name.

Quick question, Is Big Mom on Fishman Island right now or is she somewhere else in the neworld? - Copper5


 * It seems that she's somewhere else at the time. But until further info is showed, all we can say is pure speculation.

Big Mam's Abilities
I know this could be speculation, but given the tree on Big Mam's flag, could she have an earth devil fruit? I mean Ace's crew flag had fire, and he was actually using fire logia fruit. Is it possible she could have earth logia or something? And given how big she looks ,which is pretty obvious in the silhoutte, It could fit. What do you guys think?

I think we don't allow speculation on talk pages. Take it to a forum. 17:20, August 26, 2011 (UTC)

Epithet
"As some romanization mistakes occur sometimes, the romanization used in One Piece Green is the correct one." The why we use "Big Mam" instead of "Big Mom"? I'm fine with using the manga one, but then this sentence is wrong. Just want to check if there was another reason.


 * [ An IP messed up the article], then Fliu corrected it wrong. I changed it back.

http://bbs.pcgames.com.cn/viewpic.jsp?imgUrl=http://img.pconline.com.cn/images/upload/upc/tx/gamesbbs6/1112/21/c0/10014552_1324477905802_1024x1024game3.jpg


 * facepalm* That's just a photoshop of Blackbeard. SeaTerror 17:38, December 23, 2011 (UTC)

EDIT
I already read the latest chapter and have a few things to add in her page. Like this:

apparently, BIG Mam lives up to her moniker, being huge enough (comparable to Gekko Moriah) She sits at



a huge chair.

Can u unlock the page for Big Mom? As recently the new chapter 651, She and he fellow crew mates are featured in it.Detective.XD.McCartneyXIII 01:55, December 27, 2011 (UTC)

Big Mam??
Hey, today's chapter (651) gives her name as 'Big Mom' .. Same goes to the old chapter that is her profile picture now (Big Mom) .. The romanization is Big Mom..

The only time it was written Big Mam is when pappug was talkin about her.. So..?

Its actually the same problem as with Iceburg/Icebarg.Oda misspelled it wrong im sure its Big Mom. Granit Hysaj 15:44, December 26, 2011 (UTC)  GH   Talk

Her name is Big Mam, you will find always "Big Mom" because Mangastream chosen to use "Big Mom", Oda didn't write "Big Mom" since the text was in Japanese. The only time he wrote her name in romanji was in chapter 610, and he wrote "Big Mam", so her name is "Big Mam".

Actually, it is written in this chapter. http://mangastream.com/read/one_piece/16037697/13 It's the second row from the bottom, left-most panel. 16:22, December 26, 2011 (UTC)

Then why would they decide to call her mom instead of mam ? GH   Talk  Granit Hysaj 16:25, December 26, 2011 (UTC)

It's Alabasta vs. Arabasta all over again. 16:26, December 26, 2011 (UTC)

We now have two sources that say "Big Mom" and only one that says "Big Mam". (Ch 610 for "Big Mam" and Databook Green and Ch 651 for "Big Mom")

Logically, the one with the most sources should be considered correct until more information is presented. DemonRin 22:40, December 26, 2011 (UTC)

I think it is Mam,cause it would then also take the meaning of "mam", the sound of eating or opeining closing mouthto eat.Swimswimfruit 22:22, December 27, 2011 (UTC)

It still does not make sense that Oda would use 'Biggu mamu' yet write in english as 'Big Mom' so until further examples are found within the Manga or someone brings it up with Oda, I'm chalking it up as another 'Icebarg' incident. 86.185.157.47 23:48, February 4, 2012 (UTC)

old look
Can one of you members, add that she seemed to be somewhat different in the past, as i garps picture of the yonkou she not only had fewer and more square teeth but also had a straighter nose?195.1.67.181 17:51, December 26, 2011 (UTC)

There is no need to do that in my opinion, when a character is foreshadowed usually there will be some tiny differences in the actual appearance later, for example see the Shichibukai.

even so, this difference IS mentioned in the shickibukai page, so why shouldnt be mentioned here?--195.1.67.181 18:51, December 26, 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, that should probably be in the trivia or something.

Still we havent seen her face at all most of her face was shadowed so i think we will have to wait and see. 18:56, December 26, 2011 (UTC)

There are several obvious differences that i added to the trivia (Nose, teeth, etc.). It isn't confirmed yet, but she does look different, and that is something to add to trivia.

Well do as you want, I just found it not worth of mention, that's all.


 * Her current nose (according to the latest chapter) looks way more rounded then before,maybe Oda changed his concept design about her. GH   Talk  Granit Hysaj 20:41, December 26, 2011 (UTC)

Main Image
Do NOT use Mangashare's version, even if you crop it to remove their watermark. They don't want people using their stuff so we're not supposed to.

The one that is up there is a slightly cleaned up version of the Raw that's out now.DemonRin 02:47, December 27, 2011 (UTC)

Hey guys i thought you might wanna have a look on Big mom coloured, i got a hole new immage of her when i saw it. Looking at the black and white photo it looks like her head is bigger than her body, but after seing the coloured one it seems like she just have huge boobs, and is bending forward, while sitting in a chair. Please note that this is a fan made colouring and it's not official.

Nobody cares what they don't want. SeaTerror 10:42, December 28, 2011 (UTC)

trait
acording to big mom, she hates people that doesnt do what they promise. shouldnt we add this to her personality?--85.164.61.216 01:12, January 12, 2012 (UTC)

If you can squeeze it there somewhere, add it.

lpk but we are not able to edit bog mans page 12:07, January 19, 2012 (UTC)

First Name Orgin
her first name comes from charlotte de berry a lady pirate born in 1636 think about it charlotte de berry and Charlotte Linlin.

For heaven's sake, don't add so many freaking spaces. And please sign your posts with ~. And as for the origins, it's speculation. So no. 23:59, October 20, 2012 (UTC)

"Charlotte" is a common first name anyways. I doubt that pirate was the first, and she definetely wasn't the last. I've even seen a spider with the name. It's a very vague coincidence. 00:02, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

There was also a pirate named Charlotte Badger. So which one are you certain it is now? Multiple women named Charlotte isn't exactly an anomaly. 00:05, October 21, 2012 (UTC)

Her Epithet's Spelling Again
This message has been removed

Those were Chinese. --Klobis (talk) 13:27, May 20, 2013 (UTC)

Her name in the subtitles on the website i'm watching list her name as Big Mam in the subtitles and searching her name in google comes Big Mama when you type in "one piece big m".BlackDragon666 (talk) 19:58, June 23, 2013 (UTC)

Tribute to Miyazaki?
Was just wondering if anyone knew the date of Miyazaki's official retirement (or possibly an impending pervasive rumor of such) vs the dates of Big Mom's first on screen appearance (or accurate silhouette). What what they showed in the Fishman arc she does look like a generic Miyazaki witch. Bigger than everyone else, huge head, huge nose, bulbous, saliva, etc.192.152.24.115 09:18, August 28, 2015 (UTC)MFBK

I don't think Oda moved the chapter release just to get a reference. If he wanted to do a reference he would do it in a different way. She looks a bit alike but that's about it :/

Grievous67 (talk) 11:31, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

Big Mom is a giant, she's over 10 meters tall
Can we consider her a giant at this point? If you calculate it you can see Big Mom is about 11-13 meters, while sitting! We have seen large humans but this is way too large for a normal human (think that Dorry and Broggy are about 10-12 meters). Kaido and Moriah are 6 meters so they aren't giants, but 13 meters cannot be considered a normal heigh human.

And don't say "well it's speculation to say this" because we haven't seen any normal human reach the height of 10 meters. Saying that one piece humans can reach up to 10 meters is speculation in itself.

Grievous67 (talk) 11:30, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

Also, the yeti are considered as a different species in this wiki "Yetis are nearly giant-sized humanoid beings"

Grievous67 (talk) 11:33, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

We are in the dark here, as we don't know what defines a giant and what not. Therefore, we can't say anything with certainty and thus is the statement that she is a giant speculative. 11:35, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

Yes but the statement that normal people higher than 10 meters are not giants it's speculation. With giants we have seen consistency, as anybody taller than 10 meters is a giant (there are giants small as humans but not humans tall as giant), but we've never seen any normal human reach that height. It's speculation to say humans can be over 10 meters tall.

You also have to consider she's about 13 meters while sitting. She could easily be 17-18 meters on her feet

Grievous67 (talk) 11:52, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, I know. Doesn't change the outcome. 11:58, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

Besides, this is something that's not article-worthy because it is just presumed and the only proof is estimating her size using comparisons. We can call her "gigantic" but not a "giant".

Hmmm... so I guess that at this point we're coming at the conclusion that being tall is not the characteristic that makes a giant but they are giants for a completely different genetic reason. In that case we need to change the article of Giant.

Grievous67 (talk) 12:41, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

Giant is a race, we do not know if she was born into it. There are many large characters in OP that are no giants. It's speculation to say she is one without confirmation in the manga. 13:47, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

No we don't need to change the article. I don't think you're getting the point. We don't know what classifies someone as a giant, whether it's for a different genetic reason or not. We don't know anything, therefore we're not putting anything in the articles, since anything would be speculation. Getting the point? 13:55, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

Yeah I get it, I was simply saying that we need to point on the Giant page that we don't know what classifies them, if it's not already on the page

Grievous67 (talk) 15:12, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

The absence of that information confirms that we don't know what classifies them, don't you think? 15:14, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

We know exactly what classifies a Giant. A member of that species. Just because a character can be physically compared to a Giant does not make them a Giant. How is this not clear?

16:39, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

The Giant page even says "They are not to be confused with large-sized humans such as the Franky Family's Kairiki Destroyers or Bartholomew Kuma."

16:40, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

I don't even know where you're getting these numbers, "13 meters while sitting", "easily be 17-18 meters on her feet". All speculations. 17:02, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

It's exactly what me and Aurora came to say before. A giant is determined by appartaining to the species and not for being large. Also for the aproximated (that's why you quoted me wrongly, I said "about 11-13 meters) size I used Bobbin, a normal sized human, for reference. It's basic geometry in the end. We do need to put in her article she's very tall but not a part of the giant series. Let's say she's an incredibly tall human, even if we've never seen that before.

Grievous67 (talk) 17:49, August 30, 2015 (UTC)

"she is an incredibly large woman"

There you go, already on the page. 17:51, August 30, 2015 (UTC)