Talk:Ucy

Name
shouldn't we rename the page by Ucy rather than Fighting Bull. It's the same with the "One-legged soldier" and "Thunderous Soldier of Rage" concern. 41.232.210.196 21:16, July 10, 2013 (UTC)

Ucy is the name that Luffy gave him. His real name is Fighting Bull. 21:18, July 10, 2013 (UTC)

No, i think it's like Surume and Kraken. His name should be Ucy. --Salamancc (talk) 21:34, July 10, 2013 (UTC)

Kraken is a species, not a name. 21:46, July 10, 2013 (UTC)

Maybe "Fighting Bull" is also a species like fighting fish. --Salamancc (talk) 22:24, July 10, 2013 (UTC)

no, fighting bull is his name, ucy is a nickname-- 22:29, July 10, 2013 (UTC)

If "Ucy" is its nickname, why is it in the "alias" parameter? 09:55, July 11, 2013 (UTC)

But we do not say ["Ucy" Fighting Bull] like ["Straw Hat" Luffy]. --Klobis (talk) 10:27, July 11, 2013 (UTC)

Still, why put it in the "alias" parameter? 10:29, July 11, 2013 (UTC)

Just like Lucy is an alias of Luffy. --Klobis (talk) 11:11, July 11, 2013 (UTC)

Not really.. 11:16, July 11, 2013 (UTC)

its just a nickname-- 17:36, July 11, 2013 (UTC)

^^^^^ 20:45, July 11, 2013 (UTC)

Lucy is an alias while Ucy is just a nickname. 22:57, July 11, 2013 (UTC)

Since "Lucy" is an alias it should be in the "alias" parameter, but "Ucy" is a nickname not an alias. So it shouldn't be in the "alias" parameter, right? 06:19, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

Epithets tend to be more descriptive in nature though, so a nickname could be considered closer to an alias. At the end of the day they're all synonyms with slightly different connotations, so this shouldn't be such a huge deal. A benefit of having them in different parameters is that it helps keep them more distinct, so it's fine the way it is. 06:29, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

I second Zodia's statement. WU out -  08:22, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

In that case, we don't have to have the nickname in the infobox. Just put a nihongo template including the nickname and its jname and rname in the intro paragraph. 10:26, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

Wait a minute, what do you mean Ucy is a nickname.? Surume was named after Luffy too, so why do we have him as that in his page. Luffy named Ucy too, so that's what the name of this article should be. Why do you guys make exceptions, I will never understand that..

Because before that, Surume was just referred to as his species name, while here, the fighting bull has already been given a name by the people of Dressrosa. 13:15, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

What Gal said. WU out - 13:17, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

Kraken is the name of his species, not an actual name. 13:18, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

On what basis do you say "fighting bull" is a proper name? No matter how I look at it, it's just the animal type. So we should either move this page in Animal Species or call it Ucy. Even if Ucy is a nickname (but then Surume is the same) it refers only to this particular fighting bull.

The animal type is bull, while the nickname given to him by the people of Dressrosa is the fighting bull. You don't honestly believe that his species is a fighting bull, do you? 22:02, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

He was given the name "Fighting Bull". 22:08, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

@Galaxy: I honestly don't believe that nor "bull" nor "fighting bull" is his name. That said, if there is an animal called "killer whale" I won't be surprised if there is an animal called "fighting bull". Also, for those who think "fighting bull" is a proper name, why are we calling him that rather then "Tōgyū"?

@SHL: as I asked, on what basis do you say that?

on the basis that his name is fighting bull-- 22:12, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

Well, nice tautology there... the chapter says "here he comes the Colosseum's death god fighting bull" or something like that, concluding that's a name is the last thing that crossed my mind. You can change "fighting bull" with any other simple name, like assassin, gladiator and you would never think that as a proper name,. Also if there are "fighting fishes" what's so strange in a "fightinh bull"?

Because when he was introduced, he was given the name "Fighting Bull". 22:26, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

Oh thank you! Was that difficult to add a reference? Although I can't find that picture in the chapter... is it in 714?

Never mind... I find it in chapter 706. I'm still thinking that's not really his name, because if he didn't had any name to begin with it was only logical to introduce him that way, but at least now is more plausible.


 * Btw... in D block there is a "fighting lion" (ch. 706), there are also fighting fish... I find hard to believe they are proper names of characters (fighting fish isn't at least).

It was romanized that way so it is his name. SeaTerror (talk) 23:16, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

Animal Pronoun
I believe that the pronouns should be changed from "he" to "it". "It" is used for generic animals regardless of their sex. For animals, "he"/"she" is only used as pronouns for animals which you share a personal relationship with. e.g. your pet. However, this isn't a personal journal, this a formal article. And since this is an encylopedia-style wiki, I think we should change it. 11:06, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

I agree. We should indeed change it. WU out -  13:19, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

Except that this is a work of fiction, with plenty of animals (chief among them Chopper, but also Carue, Eyelashes etc) that we refer to by gender-specific pronouns. His epithet "Brutal Bull" is proof that he's male (the English word 'bull' was used). 13:41, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

Zodiaque's right. It's the same reason we added the male category. It's Fighting Bull, not Fighting Bovine. If you don't understand the reason behind something, ask before instantly assuming it's wrong. 20:47, July 12, 2013 (UTC)

Ok. 08:38, July 13, 2013 (UTC)

Death Row
The thing about him taking out death row inmates doesn't really make sense. I think it's supposed to mean the people he's facing are being defeated like he's an executioner and they're on death row. It seems to be a simile more than anything. 16:23, July 15, 2013 (UTC)

Not necessarily. From the wiki article:
 * "A gladiator ... was an armed combatant who entertained audiences in the Roman Republic and Roman Empire in violent confrontations with other gladiators, wild animals, and condemned criminals. Some gladiators were volunteers who risked their legal and social standing and their lives by appearing in the arena. Most were despised as slaves, schooled under harsh conditions, socially marginalized, and segregated even in death."

There's basis in history for death row criminals being forced to do battle against both professional gladiators and wild beasts. In that was the case, the line makes perfect sense. 16:44, July 15, 2013 (UTC)

It could also mean Ucy was once an executioner in some prison before coming to Dressrosa. 19:40, July 15, 2013 (UTC)

Well, the gladiators here are choosing to fight because they want to fight and there's nothing social about it. I still think it was a metaphor more than anything. 19:45, July 15, 2013 (UTC)