Forum:Infoboxes

As you can see, there are NO infobox guidelines at all. The only place where I have seen anything about the infoboxes themselves was in the image guidelines Image_guidelines#Profile_and_Identification_Image_Advise and that is surely not enough to comprehend everything. We need to create these guidelines to show what Infoboxes are used for, their color schemes, the ones for Devil Fruits decided in the results of the Forum (I've read it), what should infoboxes contain, and each contains certain points to be added. The creation of guidelines should make those certain points good for everyone, I for one like them all, but some people might not and this is a great opportunity to say so.

The Switch used in characters that physically changed after the time-skip(see here) has to be shown in these guidelines

I want to discuss the infoboxes that appear on each tab of the Straw Hat Pirates. I don't think that this fits with the "definition" of infoboxes from the Image Guidelines where it is called a "quick reference", however having a quick reference in every subpage isn't a "quick reference" anymore, but more of an aesthetics "thing". I just brought this up because for some reason I never noticed them before adding the switch and I deleted them thinking it was someone's doing, seems like it wasn't. Well I'm wondering if this can be an exception to that short quote and if it should be discussed or only left this way...

And now I have some problems, like in the Devil Fruit Color schemes forum(man that was a long read), the characters have their color schemes after their affiliation and they don't match with the characters themselves. Now this is my personal opinion, it is simple and straight, I don't like it this way, I think it would be best if the colors would, just like the ones for the Devil Fruits, match the color of the image from between them.

Please look at all the infobox templates and at all the information they contain. If it is unneeded or if it can still be added and say which infoboxes have to be discussed so that a subheading can be created to discuss it there.

Discussion
Honestly i dont really care about those things to much but i agree about the characters and DF part, it would just feel more normal, but it wouldn't really bother me if it didn't change

The DF colorschemes were already discussed and voted. We took the majority as the solution so we can't do much about it, but you could add on to the last forum on it and bring the topic up once more so that we can re-vote. The infobox- if you need to add it, then simply do it yourself. I personally don't see a problem in updating guidelines. 20:22, September 10, 2011 (UTC)

Well the problem is that there are no guidelines to update, they need to be created! and I just noted here what should be added, I don't want any revotes, but I want a vote like that of the DF colorschemes regarding the characters as well

Yes, there was a very long argument and discussion on infobox colors, and a final vote. I suppose it's just a matter of writing up the rules/guidelines.

I'm fine with the infobox colors, but the trouble is the pictures used. Some of them are full-body shots (i.e. all members of the Straw Hat Pirates), while some are head-shots (i.e. Brownbeard), and others are in-between (i.e. Whitebeard and Blackbeard). We should choose one of them and convert the rest. 23:59, September 10, 2011 (UTC)

Well it's not as bad as you think Yatano. I really think the pics depend on the situation. As long as there's both on the page, I'm pretty sure we won't die. And rici, well if you're worried about the guidelines, you know you could always create them yourself. 03:17, September 11, 2011 (UTC)


 * I've been delayed working on things on this wikia again thanks to new Vocaloids... Thats the problem with a growing fandom and a new of the software due in October... I feel sheepish, but the last time I set a date for editing here was the day news on a new Vocaloid was released and instead of spending my 5 hours net access a dayhere it was spent updating the Vocaloid wikia. I simply can't be relied on it seems to help at the moment, until after the Vocaloid 3 software dust settles which sadly is not until after x-mas (theres a break normally during the Jan-March period in this software where little happens). So this wikia won't see me much until that break. Sorry, I've tried to find the time, but when you have only 5 hours net and its spent with another fandom... Its a growing fandom, not like One Piece which is established so theres a HEAP of problems still organising things. And tracking down reference sources can be a pain.


 * I'm not 100% enjoying it, though I am now up to date with the storyline at least with One Piece which is something. -_-


 * Onto this wikia matters though. We only recently had a discussion on colours for info boxes, can't remedmber where it was. You'll have to revote to change it, thats fine though. Nothing is set in stone and so long as you get a majority you can go ahead. The trouble was no one made a guideline for info boxes specifically, because no one was committed to making these sort of pages anymore. Infoboxes have always been used as a "quick reference" or index, like you might find on a library book for easy look up. Take this in mind when discussing them, I'm saying it to remind everyone, I know a LOT of wikias where the editors feel the need to add just about every piece of information until they are bigger then the page itself.


 * I've always thought of the problem with colour schemes is just that we have a varity of categories of pages, and lots of possible combinations of colours. In some cases they work. In other cases they just DON'T work simply because there is too many possible ways the scheme could be done. I do note that with schemes that are "guesses" because we have no colours to work from (because all we have is the manga drawing) that its the hardest thing to work with. What we could do with is just a default scheme for "new" things that can be universal until a more accurate scheme can be picked. One-Winged Hawk 06:11, September 11, 2011 (UTC)
 * @JOPF, I knew it would get to this, and I was afraid of it, really, because I don't feel like I could manage to do it, but I'll try, I hope I won't give you to big of a headache when you have to correct certain points XD


 * @One-Winged Hawk, I've read the entire dicussion of the devil fruit color schemes and I saw that there were 3 other forums, one for a possible revote and the other two for deciding on certain colorschemes, one which contained the possibilities and allowed them to be discussed and the other one had the vote where a certain color scheme was voted for and the ones that won as I can see today are on the article of those respective DFs, there mnight be a variety of categories, but we have naviboxes too, and the naviboxes will remain the same so we won't delete the color schemes(but I'm not sure, I have a vague memory that tells me that there is no need for the colors in template form in the navibox template) we will just be adding colors, Please look at Jinbe's colors and press the pre timeskip switch(ignore the other infobox), these colors give the page a better effect, as for the manga images that have yet to appear in a color spread or for all of them as you've said Hawk, we can use a default, like gray, black and white(random order and usage), I also agree with he results from the DF colorschemes vote, but if some one will request a revote?....


 * Also, Yata, if there are no better images, then its ok, but if there are some available, or can be found, those have to be replaced since its been decided that if available, the images from the infboxes should be full-body shots


 * I will start tomorrow writing the guidelines in my sandbox, but until then, I'm just wonder if everyone agrees with the current definition given in the image guidelines...if nobody says no, then I'll take it as an "its alright, keep it as it is"


 * PS: I'm wondering about so many things and asking so many questions, because I think its best to decide now, once and for all instead of having something abppear and discussing that and then something else and something else and so on!

I don't think we have to set guidelines for everything, I mean there isn't a need to a guideline that set a certain type of sentence in italic and so on... it's not necessary until a discussion about it comes up and it can't be settled with the talk page. I don't want a "guideline overload"... about the infoboxes, you don't have to set the guidelines for it (I don't understand what you want to do, "infobox guidelines" is pretty vague), just discuss here major style choice, for example adding or deleting new infos in the infoboxes, colorscheme system (group-scheme, neutral-scheme, type-scheme, case-by-case-scheme), or other things that doesn't come up in my mind right now... if you don't like a colorscheme in particular just open the discussion in the talk page, the same goes if you think a character should have a colorshceme of another group (because he can be in different groups). Remember that there are always the talk page first... if a decision can be reached with them, then we use forum and eventually vote for a general guidelines for those kind of cases. I said this because "Infoboxes guidelines" is pretty vague, as you see we discuss different topics when they comes up (profile images, switch, colorscheme, ecc.). Well if you want to regroup the existing decisions about infoboxes in the same section than ok, it's a different matter.

I think we need at least some form of rules for infoboxes, the main problem that I think there is is pictures (size and problems Yatanogarasu mentioned above). We don't need anything too complicated, but we just need a general set of rules so people don't go and screw everything up because they don't know how it is done. Another thing I noticed, but probably isn't a problem, is that some of the infoboxes have different information between them (I am not 100% sure, but some of them seem a lot smaller), I don't know if this is because we don't have the info, or if no one bothered to put it there.  Pacifista15 | Talk | 22:48 11/Sep/2011 UTC

Levi, it is not pretty vague,there are allot of things that people don't know and they'll just add random stuff in infoboxes, I really have no complete idea about them, I understood that they have to be in every subpage, characters that appeared after the timeskip get either a switch or that picture from after the timeskip, but then, when I think about it, I realize that there are allot of things about infoboxes, 6-7 templates, for 6-7 different infoboxes, the color schemes proposal for the characters came to my mind too so I guess this is a great time to have this all written somewhere, not just told through speech, since information like that may be fake, you would have no proof that you're right, then you'll have to wait for an admin, lets say that in the worst case, not even the admin knows for sure...that might cause an edit war...or a conflict and allot of time will pass for something that if we have guidelines for them would take just 5 minutes... also I think its best if the episode box colors would be like the ones from the chapter box, I just finished it on my Infoboxes subpage(I am just suggesting this, even though I understand that these are used to differenciate the manga from the anime), the templates attributes are on the template pages so no problem with them, but vague levi? really? other than that as PX said, the image size, it needs to be added in both infoox and image guidelines. We aren't making guidelines for everything, we have only for images, trivia and vandalism rules, adding one more thing for one of the most "important" to-say so parts of this wiki, I just wonder, why are there so many templates for them. so many different types! A large variety of them, and also, I have a Q, i it ok if some arcs have anime images and some manga ones, I understand that for filler arcs, but is it really ok for canon arcs?

And now after writing so much, I lost my main idea...

There is nothing wrong with how the infoboxes are. They should just be left alone. SeaTerror 19:35, September 12, 2011 (UTC)

SeaTerror, this is a process called imporving, why are you so against improving this wiki and reject new ideas? { {User:Ricizubi/Sig4|19:41/12/Sep/2011}}

There is nothing to improve. The info boxes are already perfect. SeaTerror 20:00, September 12, 2011 (UTC)

For the image size, a 240px width will fit the infobox, though in some cases the height will be to great so you have to use another size. Yatano was talking about this problem which was already discussed (but we can revamp it). About the colorscheme of the episode box just change it, or talk it out in the template talk page. We shouldn't bypass the talk pages for small details, if you want to discuss other problems bring them up here, but what I'm saying you don't have to write a guideline to discuss a single details.

@Seaterror: The infoboxes templates are pretty messy (I'm talking about the code-system), in my opinion, in fact on the Italian wiki I have re-arranged them, but I don't think we can do the same here. Maybe here we can discuss about the informations of the infoboxes, for example.


 * Oh if you think the infobox shouldn't be showed in the character subpages, say it so we can discuss it too. Personally I think it should be, although the problem is that the infoboxes is very tall so in some cases mess up the page (thanks to the ridiculous narrow content area).

I have to say, the infobox is getting a little hard to read from time to time, several lines being crammed so full (i.e. Usopp's epithet line is crammed with multiple nicknames). If we make the infobox similar in style to the Template:Chapter box (i.e. with borders to line up each segment), then it looks better. 01:22, September 13, 2011 (UTC)


 * If you are speaking about the code, then this is the best way in my opinion and please, do not add the pipe "|" at the end of the parameter!

Can you at least answer my question, is it ok to have anime images for canon arcs?(just wondering :-|) and now I organized some topics to discuss from this forum, if there are more things to discuss, just add a section.

PS: Levi, if for every small detail we'd discuss it on a talk page, then it would make us lose focus of one thing and concentrate on the other one and also, moving from talk to talk page is making you lose some ideas you have in your head, look at what is written lower on this page, would it be better if I opened a section with those titles on 3 DIFFERENT talks?


 * I said that because up until now I didn't understand what did you want to change, and "infobox forum" sounds like you were going to remake the infoboxes.

Since when is it not ok to have anime images for canon arcs? Anime images are used on almost everything on this site. SeaTerror

Character Infoboxes Discussion
There are several things we have to discuss about them:

The Color Schemes
I propose the use of individual color schemes matching the image that the character has (also to this, the crew color schemes can remain the same, no modificcation, they will still be used in naviboxes) in the infobox, my idea is the same as the option that won the Devil Fruit Colorschemes forum vote.


 * The colorscheme are handy because by editing a template you'll change the color of multiple infoboxes, and you can see those characters as part of a group. So the problem is if a characters is part of more than one group.

On every page or on every subpage?
I agree with levi, this doesn't follow what definition I've heard of the infoboxes, them being a short reference is too much to appear on every subpage, its pretty stupid, even though I understand the aestethics behind it. And this should go for every kind of infobox (although this is the majority of them from what I've seen creating the need for the SH to have an infobox template...occupying space from categoriesXD)


 * I don't understand what you said, but I have a problem only with the fact that long infoboxes can make troubles for the pages, but I believe that they should be placed in every subpages (or if you want we can remove it from the Misc.).


 * It is worst thing if u remove it from Mist.When one subpage has let us have it to others too.


 * I think we should keep them on every subpage, just because you dont have to go back to the main page to find some basic information. Also it's not as if it takes more then the half of the page The Humaniod Typhoon | Talk  co  {{SUBST:{1|}} (UTC)  }

Epithets
I've seen this problem and in Zoro's and Sanji's infoboxes, those informations were deleted from the epithet section, they're just a waste of space, those aren't epithets anymore, like those from a wanted poster, tehy're nicknames already, gags to make fun of themselves, really no point in that, maybe a new section for it or in the relationship secdtion, but baka marimo epithet? really? we should just keep the official ones there, like "pirate hungter" or "cotton-candy lover"


 * That's a problem, a solution can be move those epithet (aside from the most important) in a section in the article or even get rid of the romanizations/Japanese names of some of them.


 * i would delete the useless ephitets, mainly because i don't think many people care about someone being called "baka", thousands of people have been called like that already. The Humaniod Typhoon | Talk  co  {{SUBST:{1|}} (UTC)  }

I said leave the "official" nicknames in the infobox and move the other in the "relationship" section. For official nickname I mean those who are used by everybody not by a single person or between the crew members. Some example:
 * "Pirates Hunter Zoro" → official
 * "Marimo" → not official
 * "Elder Nyon" → official
 * "God Enel" → official
 * "Earlobes" → not official

So we should keep only the official ones there not everything, I don't really care in what ways Sanji called Zoro, in an infobox, this can be added in the personality section

It is a good plan of adding only official names.It can be added to relationship status in articles better than personality section.Anyway both stay on one page 09:12, September 27, 2011 (UTC)

Voting Time
The restrictions for voting are, unless the community says otherwise, min 300 edits and 3 month on the wiki. The restriction are only for voting, not for the discussion.

The poll will last two weeks, so it will end at the 00:00 am of the 31th October. (if you want to change the duration discuss it).

What should we do about the character colorschemes?

 * We should make them blend in with the infobox picture like the Devil Fruit infobox colors (a colorscheme for each character)
 * 15:12, October 18, 2011 (UTC)
 * 15:12, October 18, 2011 (UTC)
 * 15:12, October 18, 2011 (UTC)


 * We should keep them as they are now (By affiliation)
 * 17:59, October 18, 2011 (UTC)
 * 1) 海賊-姫 03:21, October 19, 2011 (UTC)
 * 2)  Pacifista15 | Talk | 12:29 20/Oct/2011 UTC
 * 3) SeaTerror 02:32, October 21, 2011 (UTC)
 * 1)  Pacifista15 | Talk | 12:29 20/Oct/2011 UTC
 * 2) SeaTerror 02:32, October 21, 2011 (UTC)
 * 1) SeaTerror 02:32, October 21, 2011 (UTC)


 * Neutral

Should we use unofficial epithets in character infoboxes?

 * Yes


 * No (Move them to other sections)
 * 1) Bastian964 16:51, October 18, 2011 (UTC)
 * 17:59, October 18, 2011 (UTC) This actually really bothers me.
 * 1) 海賊-姫 03:21, October 19, 2011 (UTC)
 * 1) Bastian964 16:51, October 18, 2011 (UTC)
 * 17:59, October 18, 2011 (UTC) This actually really bothers me.
 * 1) 海賊-姫 03:21, October 19, 2011 (UTC)
 * 1) 海賊-姫 03:21, October 19, 2011 (UTC)


 * Neutral
 * 15:12, October 18, 2011 (UTC)
 * 1) SeaTerror 02:33, October 21, 2011 (UTC)

Vote Discussion
I don't think the first point is necessary, I mean there are already guidelines for infoboxes (or rather decisions about them), and the other points are already guidelines-points, you can remove the first point in my opinion. Ah you forgot the default restrictions.

Sorry Levi, I really am not feeling like making votes today, but if I don't do it today, I won't do it tomorrow or the next day, you can take care of it for now since I still have some hw to do, I think, either way, mom is on my nerves.

For the colorschemes, I will point out that although some characters have or could have a personal color/colorscheme (like the strawhats), think about all the filler charachters, civilians and even every marine. In my opinion, most of the colorscheme will become just random and messy and yes, the current colorschemes can be random too but since they are divided in groups, they are at least organized. The case of the devil fruits is a little different, since there are only 3 groups while each devil fruits has no relation with others, but for characters (and island, groups...) there are so many groups and possible bigger groups like pirates/marines/civilians. So in my opinion the two cases are different.

Ah if nobody disagree, I'd like to remove the first point since it's pointless (of course there will be guidelines since we are voting for them and we have already made decisions regarding the infoboxes so there are already guidelines).


 * Yeah true, delete it....