Talk:Roronoa Zoro

Trivia
I added the following to his trivia section "In Chapter 401, Kaku states "I can feel your spirit, [Zoro]. An ominous beast like spirit" whether this is a nod towards Zoro being a Haki user or not currently remains unclear. However, Kaku's later comments on Zoro's Kyūtōryū seem to support this. " I hope this qualifies as acceptable trivia. YTOfficer01 29/06/2009 10:53pm

Believe or no believe?
hi I just want to say that in my opinion Zoro is not an atheist, he is an agnostic, that is more accurate, because once in the Enel saga he states he doesn't give a damn if god exist or not, instead of saying that he doesn't believe in god, I'm searching for the episode or chapter but i cant find it, also it may only be a translation difference, thats why i want to check, oh and sorry for my bad English, really!!! bye! "ISMAEL VC"

Sword Articles
Should we gives Zoro's swords their own articles? Not the unnamed ones just the famous ones? Cody2526 04:45, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

We already did.... I check and make sure.

Joekido

Zoro's sense of direction (or lack of it)
In earlier episodes, it was Luffy who had this weakness. Somehow it became Zoro's. Anyone else noticed?

For example in ep. 12 (Kuro arc), Luffy ran towards the other side of the island where Kuro's men have landed. He kept running around the island lost, not knowing how to go north. Zoro, stuck in grease thanks to Nami, was able to leave several minutes later but somehow he and Luffy arrived at the same time to save Ussop and Nami.

Another is ep. 48 at Loguetown. Luffy got lost in town looking for the scaffold where Gol D. Roger was executed. On the way he met Smoker and asked for directions. Smoker told him that it's the way the smoke is blowing, and so Luffy went. However, Luffy got lost again and ended up at Bar Gold Roger.

I'm trying to find exactly where Zoro started to be depicted as bad at directions. But I'm quite certain it's after they got to the Grand Line.

This is just an observation. Maybe Oda Sensei realized (later) that Zoro should have some sort of weakness. Luffy already has several weaknesses - the sea, being a 能力者, and sharp and pointed objects. So he "gave" Zoro this one and took it from Luffy. –


 * Please sign your posts with ~ and remember this isn't a forum. That said, Zoro still got lost between leaving the slope and arriving. They both have bad direction senses but Zoro's is worst. One-Winged Hawk 19:03, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Sorry I'll sign from now on. Thanks for the comment. But no, Zoro didn't get lost. If you have a collection of the anime (I do) please check ep. 12. Zoro just got away from the grease and the next time he was shown was with Luffy beating up Kuro's guys. In the manga, it's Chapter 29 "The slope" page 11 where Zoro escaped the grease and page 21 where he appeared at the north slope - without getting lost. Yohohoho! 06:19, 6 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Okay then ignore me I'm wrong. I should rewatch the Kuro arc... I seem to be slipping up on things. :-/ One-Winged Hawk 14:08, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Just wondering, can anyone recall where the quote (see the article on Zoro) made by Sanji on Zoro's absurd direction sense came from? red_devils_27 09:19, 16 June 2008 (UTC)

Uh, wow. Wasn't Zoro first introduced as wandering from island to island hunting pirates because he was completely and utterly lost? This has always been a major element of his character.

I think he started when they were hunting a south bird with Robin. Zoro: I know you are hiding your true intentions, I still don't trust you. Robin: But that's the way back... Chapet 230 page14 --Coldhandzz 03:12, 13 April 2009 (UTC)

512 Spoilers
Forum:Index

Discussion moved to forum. One-Winged Hawk 00:00, November 18, 2009 (UTC)

So where is he now? POST Kuma
He was sent to where Perona is, but for what reason. It was evident that each member was sent to a place to strengthen themselves...so why a haunted castle for Zoro?

What are your thoughts?

This isn't a forum. And don't forget to sign your name. :] Subrosian 22:38, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

Zoro is the First Mate
We should change the theory that fans only think Zoro might the first mate. He is the first mate.

In One Piece 499 (manga), page 17, Urouge says: "Only the First mate, and yet he has a bounty of..." (as proof)

Well, there are obviously more reasons. In times of crises, Zoro says what to do when that idiot Luffy doesn't know what to do. He's called the champion of Luffy and the only one who is able to compete with Luffy (although it is ridiculous how much power Luffy has without even training...)

And I hope there aren't any idiots here who start of with saying "but Sanji is also as strong as.." or "Nami's giving most of the commands in daily life"

Sanji is the third strongest fighter, that's it. i would even say that Nami may have the position of the second mate, simply because Zoro doesn't have the time of controlling the daily life. he spends his time with training and sleeping, as you all now. BUT, if there are really difficult decisions to make, Zoro's the one to help out.

Last argument: Zolo is the one Luffy trusts the most. that's what the first mate is for.

Are we gonna change the article? --Funk--


 * While technically Zoro is the first mate, he hasn't been actually addressed as that. The Urouge thing was mistranslation if I'm correct. Also your other reasons, other than being a bit ranty, are kinda viewer based. Indeed Zoro has some things that the rest of crew doesn't have, however that doesn't change the fact that he wasn't addressed as the first mate. Mugiwara Franky 20:35, 23 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Can you sign your posts the proper way by signing them  ~ .


 * Also, while you dismiss those arguments, they are pretty solid pointers. Calling people idiots for it is a step too far across the "out of order" line. Please do not insult users, even if its on passing comment form. You came off as very demanding "are we gonna change the article?" sounds more like your trying to force an opinion here. As this is the discussion page, I ask you be more formal, treat others how you wish to be treated.


 * And yes, from what I gather it does seem to be a translator error. The actual translation was suppose to have been "the second" which as you can pray tell makes no sense when written in English text. The second just refers to his position on his crew, he is the second member. As far as I can tell, this translation hasn't been update but if you have proof show me the link. If its just referring to the Onemanga translation... Er, better not as thats not the best translation on the net and there have been some simply awful translations put up. >_<' One-Winged Hawk 23:27, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

How did I miss this? Zoro is not the first mate. That was a translation error as Angel has already pointed out. He is never called the first mate any where. Every single crew member has given out orders before so there is no first mate. They are more like a family than just crewmates. Zoro is never called the first mate and never will be. If I see him getting called that I revert it right away and consider it vandalism. Drunk Samurai 00:51, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

Zoro is a first mate, he was the first person to join Luffy so leave it.

Joekido 01:07, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

Since when is the first mate always the first person to join a crew? Drunk Samurai 01:35, 24 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Ditto, a lot of ships go out to sea with captains, chefs, navigators but no second mate. One-Winged Hawk 10:13, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

- Bla, bla bla. Politeness, etc. You don't need to lecture me. The only thing I'm saying is that many peoples are idiots, I didn't refer to anybody personally, so don't come up with bla bla bla.

And yeah, I referred to the onemanga translation. mmh, now, if it is a translation error, i guess, there is nothing to do but to wait for oda to say it, so all doubts will be gone. and what if he never says it? a pity... :( -the man- 13:06, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

Check this out for your self.
This is a link to show that in the One Piece Manga where Urouge says Zoro is first mate. http://www.mangafox.com/manga/one_piece/v51/c499/16.html 68.65.39.173 04:08, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

You failed to read any of the talk page comments. We all said that is a mistranslation. Drunk Samurai 04:54, 24 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Thats the same translation as the one used by one manga...


 * Perhaps you should visit the scanlations section of Arlong Park Forums or use Stephen's translations. Please don't use this scanlation, it was written within a few days of the chapter release, before the real discussions took place. Scanlations released before the following Monday often have bugs in them. By Monday, all errors are cleared up. One-Winged Hawk 11:09, 24 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Here is Stephen's Translation, which uses "second in command". Most people would recommend his translations as he is regarded as providing the best English translation of One Piece and he is spot on 93% of the time, wherein other translators tend to produce a 73% correctness level. The word for First Mate in Japanese, I can say, never appeared in this chapter. One-Winged Hawk 11:15, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

u people r drunk hes the first mate dude first to join there for first mate just like Rayleigh is rogers first mate first to join aka first mate and common now Nami she already has a title and as for her giving out orders shes a women what lady doesn't act bossy she gives Luffy orders so what he's not the captain now...Zoro's role in the crew is self explanatory people...HE'S LUFFY'S RIGHT HAND thank u for letting me speak my peace p.s. hes the Ben Beckmen of the crew u said it yourself right in your article on Ben Beckmen brooklynboi143 ,7:49 11/29/09


 * Can you rephrase this in standard English not text speak please. I'm sorry but its hard to read. And no, we keep saying this he isn't the first mate, he has NEVER been called this in the series. Only in the English versions. And the bit about Nami is so vague... O_O' One-Winged Hawk 15:53, November 29, 2009 (UTC)

Being the first person to join does not mean first mate. Drunk Samurai 17:17, November 29, 2009 (UTC)

Sense of Direction Info?
I think Zoro has had bad direction since the start of the story. It on two pages on how he got his name I think. Here is the link

Enies Lobby
is there a reason why there is no info whatsoever of Zoro in Enies Loby? it just jumps from when they get on Rocketman to when they are about to burn the Going Merry. WhiteStrike 12:10, 14 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Because we're lazy and/or busy and haven't gotten round to it yet.


 * Serious answer: reading chapters takes TIME, usually you have to set aside an hour of chapter by chapter reading at least to sum up the events. People write the history sections when they get the chance, as unless they came out this week, its a homework and a half. One-Winged Hawk 22:35, September 30, 2009 (UTC)

Locked Page
I kinda spotted a bit in the history section with no paragraphs and the page is locked... One-Winged Hawk 21:49, November 14, 2009 (UTC)

It unlocks tomorrow. The Pope 22:16, November 14, 2009 (UTC)

Asura
not sure if this has been mentioned before as i am new to this wikia, but in the Enies Lobby arc before using his Asura technique he says something along the lines of 'demon spirit Asura', could this mean he summons or gains aspects of the spirit Fawcettp 13:16, November 17, 2009 (UTC)


 * It's just he's saying the technique name. The atheist isn't summoning any spirit. The technique however does give the illusion of Zoro gaining multiple arms and heads like a real Asura. Mugiwara Franky 13:24, November 17, 2009 (UTC)


 * OK thanks, as i said I'm new to this wikia Fawcettp 14:16, November 17, 2009 (UTC)


 * That's okay. You're welcome.Mugiwara Franky 14:17, November 17, 2009 (UTC)

Zoro's Former Swords
Sorry, i edited the info because Zoro uses the Marine Cutlass in the manga as well as the anime, if you look at chapter 426 pgs 13-14

Need to do some cleanup
A problem is that many of the pages reflect more on the general plot and not on Zoro and needs to be dealt with to achieve better quality, including the stuff that does not reflect on Zoro. -Adv193 06:24, November 29, 2009 (UTC)

Quote add
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/380/10-11/

"Leave it to luck" I want to add to the page... But you know... Its locked. I hate to say it, but the locks becoming a problem. One-Winged Hawk 14:15, December 5, 2009 (UTC)


 * Lock removed.Mugiwara Franky 14:30, December 5, 2009 (UTC)


 * Properly needs adjusting but its on the page. I've sepent 4 or so hours editing and have a headache now so I'm stopping for the day. One-Winged Hawk 14:36, December 5, 2009 (UTC)

Automated transfer of Problem Report #26841
The following message was left by BSK2009 via PR #26841 on 2009-11-26 01:00:48 UTC

Whoever did the Skypeia section must be prevented from editing ever again. Although there is a note hinting the problem with the section, it's really annoying. In addition to extreme briefness, grammar mistakes litter the the section. Someone please take care of this. Zoro is a favorite character of mine, so it really hurts.

Skypeia
Okay, I completely re-wrote the travesty of the Skypeia section for Zoro. I hope I did a good job, thank you.

--The Howling Wolf 23:37, January 12, 2010 (UTC)


 * Youd did a good job, but the section can still be improved. There are some sentences like "the Skypeian man explains to Chopper, Sanji and Luffy that the others on the Going Merry will be taken to The Sacrifical Altar." which are not referring to Zoro. Try to rewrite them from Zoro's point of view. His actions can be described with some more details. The style can be slightly improved, and last but not least, links must be added. El Chupacabra 14:58, January 13, 2010 (UTC)

5 Litres?
I'm curious where/when Oda stated that Zoro lost 5 litres of blood during the Hachi fight? If anyone could share with me, it'd be much appreciated. 24.11.152.212 07:31, January 23, 2010 (UTC)


 * Reference anyone? This is important! One-Winged Hawk 19:30, January 27, 2010 (UTC)

THE BREATH OF ALL THINGS.
Why isnt Zoros ability to hear the Breath of all things included on his page?This ability is the basis of his steel cutting and flying slash techs,it ought to be there. Zionite7 18:10, January 27, 2010 (UTC)


 * Okay point taken, but instead of complaining, add it yourself would be better. Thats how wikias work, someone notices something missing, they add it. Also, don't use capitals, its considered SHOUTING and can be taken as rude on the net. And please sign your posts with ~ as not adding it can also be considered rude. One-Winged Hawk 19:21, January 27, 2010 (UTC)
 * In the anime Zoro cuts large steel chains in episode 59 before the whole breath of all things that he needed to cut steel swords. whats the deal with that? and here you go guy 76.25.47.52 05:44, May 14, 2010 (UTC)
 * In the anime Zoro cuts large steel chains in episode 59 before the whole breath of all things that he needed to cut steel swords. whats the deal with that? and here you go guy 76.25.47.52 05:44, May 14, 2010 (UTC)


 * This is not canon and in Warship Island Arc, it is put as a plot hole of the anime. Kdom 07:01, May 14, 2010 (UTC)

ZORO = LUFFY in terms of strenght
FROM ONE PIECE ENCICLOPEDIA YELLOW PAGE 46:

http://img50.imageshack.us/img50/7479/zoroyellowor3.jpg

ルフィと肩 を並べるほどの高い戦力を持ちながら、必要以上前に出ず、あくまで戦闘員として動くのも、ルフ ィを 船長として認めているからだ.

"Although [Zoro] has an high fighting power equal to Luffy's, he doesn't expose himself too much and he takes the role of fighter because he has accepted Luffy as his Captain having absolute trust for him."

LUFFY = ZORO

Since the wiki says that zoro is the strongest after luffy


 * Firstly, don't delete old messages to make way for yours. secondly, sigh your messages with ~ as its polite. One-Winged Hawk 20:45, February 26, 2010 (UTC)


 * Since there is no signature, I take it you are the contributor who edits the first paragraph to say that 1) Zoro is the First Mate, and 2) Zoro is the strongest member in the crew with Luffy. The reason we keep undoing your edit is because the first statement is based purely on speculation; in Topic #7, it has already been settled that Zoro was never formally acknowledged as or appointed First Mate, and therefore saying he is would be pure speculation. If you would like to provide counterproof, please do so without simply changing the article with no explanation. Also, thank you for providing proof to support your second statement, but please make a formal reference to proof after the statement (check the rest of the article for examples on how) so that the rest of us know it is a real fact. Raikia 21:01, February 26, 2010 (UTC)


 * Yeah its the same anon. That still leaves Zoro without the title of "first mate" regardless.


 * One thing to note is strength may be equal, but styles create slight variations. Also the problem even folks at AP forums had to admit is "define power". Power as in physical raw, spiritaul, etc, etc, you get the idea. Plus, databooks are correct at the time of release, but are subject to change as Oda makes see fit, that means we need another databook soon. But for now, yes it would be correct. We've generally however avoided strength comparisons between crewmembers due to edits wars we had over the issue a few years back. Part of me still thinks strenght of crew comparisons should be avoided as much as possible in case of arguments. But thats subject to debate. One-Winged Hawk 21:23, February 26, 2010 (UTC)


 * I thought about that, since there is a difference between Zoro and Luffy being equally strong, and Zoro and Luffy being acknowledged as equally strong. The 2:5 ratio in their bounties shows that Luffy is more widely acknowledged as a much larger threat. Avoiding strength comparisons seems like a good idea though, so maybe the statement can be cut down to just say that Zoro is widely acknowledged as the most dangerous in the crew after Luffy, currently holding the second highest bounty. Raikia 21:33, February 26, 2010 (UTC)


 * I think the article is already saying that, thats the problem. But yes, it can be written to avoid the comparisons if needed as it was anyway (or should have been). Though with proof its fine to say it anyway. :-/ One-Winged Hawk 21:35, February 26, 2010 (UTC)


 * True. The encyclopedia yellow page seems like too good of a source of evidence to waste, so maybe the part about Zoro more or less choosing to let Luffy take the spotlight can be integrated into the Personality section. I'm not sure how the page could be referenced though, do the sources all have to be links? x-x Raikia 21:58, February 26, 2010 (UTC)


 * For now, avoid the "ref name=" style of referencing and just write style. We can correct you later, plus I don't think the databooks are sorted yet. So yeah, don't bother linking to the databook for now, we'll correct that later. ;-) One-Winged Hawk 00:27, March 4, 2010 (UTC)

My Addition
There is no reason at all to remove it. Especially when not giving a reason for it at all. SeaTerror 19:19, March 20, 2010 (UTC)


 * Knock it off, Both of you!


 * SeaTerror: Quite a bit of its very fannish and if it belongs anywhere it is not in the introduction. Possibly trivia but its quite trival in the long run espcieally when part of it already is expressed in the rest of the article e.g. Luffy's and Zoro's relationship.


 * Tipota: Don't just undo willy nilly, give an explanation why it should not be on the page.
 * --Uncanny Ultrabeast 19:50, March 20, 2010 (UTC)

I came here before a long time ago but never edited and saw it. It had been there for a long time and it was removed for no reason. SeaTerror 03:44, March 21, 2010 (UTC)


 * Okay. It's good that you brought attention to it because it should not be there. Where it belongs is the Mythbusters, where there already is an entry for it.--Uncanny Ultrabeast 10:32, March 21, 2010 (UTC)


 * Ditto on that. I myself removed it at least once, partly because of that and partly because the intro was getting too long. One-Winged Hawk 11:07, March 21, 2010 (UTC)


 * That's why I put the whole ship duties thing elsewhere, simply because intro is long enough already.--Uncanny Ultrabeast 11:26, March 21, 2010 (UTC)

Possible Mysterious Swordsman identity thought?
I have a thought of who the Mysterious Swordsman might be? I think that it might be Kitetsu the maker of the three cursed swords. After all the Island is a dark graveyard like place and is the perfect place for the someone who made the three cursed swords. Daikari 07:38, April 13, 2010 (UTC)

Speculation. And the title of each of the swords suggests that they could have made by the same family "Kitetsu" and three generations of that family. On the other hand, possessing a sword doesn't indicate skills at forging one. --One Piece Of Romance Dawn 14:26, June 2, 2010 (UTC)

Never sheds a tear?
Should it be noted in the "Personality" section that Zoro is the only one of the Strawhat crew to never be seen crying in scenes of deep emotion? Stuff like the death of Merry and Vivi's departure. 2xN 02:44, May 13, 2010 (UTC)

(Kazm) He has cried. He cried after Mihawk defeated him. So it's not accurate to say he never sheds a tear. (Kazm)

one of the strongest characters?
i just edited this.we cannot classify him as one of the strongest characters just because he is the second strongest character in luffys crew.did you forget that he with the whole crew was defeated by a kuma and he was defeated by that guy twise without inflicting any serious damage one his opponent.it is for sure since he is one of the main protagonists that he will be one of the strngest characters in the series but not for now.Halaros 19:29, June 15, 2010 (UTC)

Please read manga and follow the anime. Zoro had fought againt Ryuma who was a strength based swordsman (according to Brook) and had taken 2 serious hits from Oars the biggest zombie on Thriller Bark with Luffy's shadow in it. Who says he didn't inflict any damage on Kuma? He attacked him with a Shishi Shonson(Lion's song) and seriously damaged one of his legs. He was tired from his fight with Oars & Ryuma so its impossible for him to fight at 100%. It was the same thing on Saboady cause his wounds had not healed at that point in time. He was able to take all the damage of Luffy inspite of all the damage inflicted on him on Thriller Bark. Kuma had himself mentioned his astonishment when he saw him alive on Saboady Grooves. If that is not supposed to be a test of strength and stamina then I wonder what else is. You are uselessly removing a valid theory just cause he did not fight on equal terms with kuma. Rohdes 19:52, June 15, 2010 (UTC)

i did not say he did not inflict damage to him i said that he did not inflict any SERIOUS damage to him he managed to cut him only one time and just because he caught him offguard.and the second time when he with the whole crew was defeated by kuma?dont tell me that he was damaged by his fight with the pacifista because the point is that if he was one of the strongest characters he should have no problem killing easily the pacifista considering how easily kuma or boa was able to defeat the pacifista.valid theory???????hahaha you are funny?shanks whitebeard se3ngoku those guys can be called the strongests characters in the series or do you really believe that zoro can be conpared to them?he is just an insect comparing to those guys.an admiral also could defeat him easily.mihawk the same since he was much stronger than luffy and zoro is weaker or equal to luffy.if there are so many guys who can kill him easily how can he be one of the strngest characters?just because you like him and he is cool does not make him one of the strongest characters.for example i like smoker who is much stronger than zoro but i m not saying he is one of the strongest cause that would be invalid.dont edit it again unless you can prove your point here.Halaros 20:05, June 15, 2010 (UTC)

What's with the comparision issue? Have you seen Mihawk or Sengoku destroy any Pacifista's? Wikia works on proof, not speculation. As we have not seen the full extent of most people's power you cannot just put them above others. Try and gauge the situation. The editor who wrote it is not saying Zoro is the strongest fighter. He is saying he is one of the strongest fighter introduced in this series. That is true as of now. Unless you have concerete evidence from manga or anime or interview from Oda Sensei you have no right to call anyone weak or strong. Your preference and opinion are of no concern to wikia articles. It is mandatory you follow the guidelines as we all do when editing wikia articles. A tired Zoro losing in his fight to Kuma is not reason enough for you to judge him as a weak character. Rohdes 03:47, June 16, 2010 (UTC)

I DID NOT SAY that mihawk could defeat a pacifista(though i think that he could).do you even read my comments????i just said that mihawk is much much powerful than him because he is much more powerful than luffy.and you know kuma anmd boa were able to destroy a pacifista EASILY i mentioned that before but as it seems you do not read what i m writting when he is so much weaker from this charactersw how can you call him one one of the strngest?man i know you are not saying he is the strongest no need to explain that.you are becoming more ridiculous you are the one who is expressing his own opinion just because you are a fan of him.of course it is a reason to call him weak because he was defeated EASILY with the whole strawhat crew with him.and there are so many characters who are so much stronger than him like mihawk because he was much strnger than luffy smoker also because he is much stronger than luffy kuma cause he defeated the whole strawhat crew twice(though the first time luffy did not fought) doflamingo cause he was able to defeat oars in one hit which i dont think zoro could do whitebeard(i suppose there is no need to explain that unless you are stupid so there is no point in discussing) marco cause he was able to fight onb par with the admirals vista (able to fight on par with mihawk)ace could defeat him easily cause he was a logia all the admirals also could defeat him easily(please dont ask me to explain that cause it just needs common logic to understand it) jinbei being so stronger than luffy shanks(also no need to explain) sengoku cause he is the fleet admiral garp cause he was on equal level with gol d roger and whitebeard mangellan cause he was able to dfeat easily luffy ivankov cause he was able to fight on par with kuma and of course there might be other characters as well.so knowing that there are so many characters who can not just defeat him but defeat him EASILY it is easy to understand that we cannot call him one of the strongest.futheremore you should understand that the title "one of the strongest"can be given to a very limited number of characters. if it was to give it by your logic then all of the characters mentioned before and all of the characters that might not be able to beat him but who are close to him in strength would be called"one of the strngest"i think you can understand that we cannot have so many "strongest characters"so stop being a fanboy and stop editing this page to express your personal preferences on a certain character.Halaros 05:50, June 16, 2010 (UTC)

Please stop editing the same sentence over and over again. The points expressed above by the other posters are valid and actually facts. Your points are just some comparisons between already mighty characters and don't state anything specifically. This sentence about Zoro is accurate because of his Super-Human Strength. Stop questioning what is fact.

of course he has super human strength.so WHAT?i can find you so many characters in one piece who have superhuman strength.yeah of course my point is a comparison because that is the way you understand someones level of strength by comparing it with other characters for the same series.and if all those characters that i mentioned before can defeat him he cannot be called one of the strongest characters.dont you understand that someone who is called onje of the strongest characters must be someone who can be defeated by an extremely limited amount of other characters?why cant you understand this.someone who is truly one of the strongest characters cannot be easily overpowered by other characters and especially by so many others like all those that i mentioned before.so before you edit something use common logic and dont call an invalid assumption as "fact".Halaros 17:55, June 23, 2010 (UTC)