Template talk:Charlotte Family Gallery

Order
The order is needed only on this template due to the sheer number of family members. SeaTerror (talk) 18:54, October 25, 2016 (UTC)

Um, not really? The gallery is to guide the user to each Charlotte Family member page, where that information is contained. Anyone could figure out pretty easily that we're arranging them by birth order as soon as they look at a few pages (or remember what they've read) - so ultimately, labeling their birth order does not assist with navigation in any way. People know Cracker as Cracker, not as Son No. 10. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 21:32, October 25, 2016 (UTC)

This is the only place on the wiki that has all the numbers, it's pretty handy. 23:59, October 25, 2016 (UTC)

As much as I hate to agree with ST, the gallery really isn't the place for the birth order. Maybe we should have a table of No., Name, Position, Marital status, Status, and Notes. Maybe name reference, Father, and Children. Rhavkin (talk) 06:14, October 26, 2016 (UTC)

Luckily for you, you're disagreeing with ST actually. I think a table would be good. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 13:04, October 26, 2016 (UTC)


 * I agree that it's needed. Rhavkin (talk) 13:06, October 26, 2016 (UTC)

We don't need an additional table, just leave the numbers in the portrait gallery. There's nothing wrong with that, we do it for Zombie. 18:36, October 27, 2016 (UTC)

There is no additional table. The information is all in one table. SeaTerror (talk) 18:43, October 27, 2016 (UTC)

Keep the numbers, it's fine and useful. 20:13, October 27, 2016 (UTC)

So wait, if it's not the numbers that's the problem, what's the issue with the order then? What other order would even be done? 03:09, October 28, 2016 (UTC)

While we're on the subject, does anyone know exactly what word Oda uses for "son" or "daughter" when introducing the Charlotte children? I realize we haven't met a lot of them, but I've noticed that none of the numbers we've seen match, making me wonder if the numbers are actually overall birth order. Does anyone know? 05:09, October 28, 2016 (UTC)

Thankfully we got two sons and a daughter in the last chapter for confirmation. Here, you can see that Mont-d'Or is referred to as 19男, "男" meaning "Male", while it looks like Galette is referred to as 18女, "女" meaning "woman/female". So they're not specifically referred to as sons (子息/息子さん/令息) and daughters (お嬢/娘/愚女), it's something you instead have to infer because of how we know they are Big Mom's children.

Possibly unrelated, but I noticed that the children have their last name, Charlotte, imposed over a giant letter S in their infoboxes, much like Caesar did with his "Master" epithet/alias. I know Charlotte has been confirmed as being spelled with a C (unlike the Nefeltari fiasco), but does anyone think that's worth noting somewhere?--Xilinoc (talk) 14:49, October 28, 2016 (UTC)

Best to leave the numbers in the portrait gallery 18:40, November 13, 2016 (UTC)

I also support leaving the numbers. 18:48, November 13, 2016 (UTC)

Clear majority for keeping the numbers. 13:13, November 15, 2016 (UTC)

Allies and Affiliates

 * It was stated the Carmel has an unknown connection to the family.
 * The family have some sort of authority over the Big Mom Pirates, and it was confirmed that the family is the basic of the crew.
 * The Vinsmoke family have allied themselves with the Charlotte Family and the 'deal' would be completed with Sanji and Pudding's wedding.

They are connected to the Charlotte family in one way or another so I believe they should be mention. Rhavkin (talk) 04:22, May 2, 2017 (UTC)

Linlins parents
shouldnt we add linlins parents and her stepmother carmel as grandparents? CharlotteSmoothie (talk) 19:39, May 26, 2017 (UTC)

Exually, I was more in line of removing Carmel since know we know she has nothing to do with the actual family, only to Linlin. Rhavkin (talk) 19:45, May 26, 2017 (UTC)

She was her stepmother, so she should have her place in this template, but linlins real parents have to be ther too CharlotteSmoothie (talk) 09:15, May 27, 2017 (UTC)

She ran an orphanage, she's hardly her stepmother. And this template is more about the 129 that Pudding mentioned (+2 in-laws +1 grandchild). Rhavkin (talk) 11:41, May 27, 2017 (UTC)

a orphanage leader is a stepmother to the children in the orphanage CharlotteSmoothie (talk) 16:31, May 27, 2017 (UTC)

First of all, an orphanage leader could also be a "Guardian" or a "Caregiver". And judging by Chapter 867, Carmel was none of the above. Rhavkin (talk) 04:15, June 2, 2017 (UTC)

Nusstorte
Nusstorte was confirmed to be older then Mont-d'Or but not Moscato, so he should be place between them. Kaido disagree, and believe the Mosctco speculation (younger then...) trump the Mont-d'Or fact (older then...). Rhavkin (talk) 18:41, November 29, 2017 (UTC)

Since the gallery is in age order, placing Nusstorte between Moscato and Mont d'Or indicates that he is between the two in age, when he could easily be the 11th through 15th child. We can put Amande between Compote and Brulee because Compote is the first daughter, but there are possibilities before and after Moscato. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 21:30, December 9, 2017 (UTC)

Placing him before Moscato is speculation- agreed. But he is already after him so that hasn't changed, and we know for a FACT that he is older than Mont-d'Or, so he should be place before his at least despite his number being unknown. Amanda is indeed a different case, but are you really saying that if we know the fifth daughter, you would moved her to after Pudding? Rhavkin (talk) 21:42, December 9, 2017 (UTC)

I'm not sure what your logic regarding Moscato is. If your Amande situation happened, then yes I would support putting her after Pudding. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 02:04, December 10, 2017 (UTC)

Chapter 845's Kids
Given new facts (the decuplets' and Flampe's ranks) there seems to be only nine younger children since the decuplets have the 40th out of 46 sons, and Flampe is the 36th out of 39 daughters. Chapter 845 gave as six unnamed characters (fishman son, bandaged son, snakeneck son, hood son, fairy daughter, and teeth daughter) along with Anana, Anglais, Dolce, and Dragée (ten total). Big Mom explicitly said to Anana, Dolce, and Dragée to stop fighting for their sister's wedding, and since we do not know which of the sons are not a sons but (probably) grandson, I would like to suggest to add an "unknown relation" section for Anglais, the six unnamed kids, as well as other unidentified probable family members. Rhavkin (talk) 18:33, February 13, 2018 (UTC)

Big Mom wasn't just talking to Anana, Dolce, and Dragee when telling them to get along; one of the other kids had chimed in against Anana before Big Mom addressed them. So we can't really assume anything more than the kids being Pudding's siblings; there do seem to be more young boys than are possible, but we have the same amount of evidence toward them being grandchildren/etc. as we do for them not being related at all. And Anglais referred to his siblings as "my brothers" Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 19:14, March 10, 2018 (UTC)

After a rereading, Big Mom indeed also talked to the hood son so he can be placed there. We already list Pez as a grandson so even if they are grandchildren they should still be listed, but because we do not know which is a direct child and who is a grandchild we can't list them as either. Hence the Unknown relation. And Anglais wasn't moved. Rhavkin (talk) 19:44, March 10, 2018 (UTC)

The problem is, if you are claiming that they could possibly not be Big Mom's kids, then where is the evidence that they are related at all? Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 23:54, March 10, 2018 (UTC)

The same reason they were thought to be her children in the first place. Rhavkin (talk) 05:48, March 11, 2018 (UTC)

They were all in the same room so they are all more likely to be children. Grandchild should only be used for actual stated grandchildren. SeaTerror (talk) 22:32, March 11, 2018 (UTC)

What does being in the same room has to do with the relation? And any family member should only be added after being actually stated, but since we do not know what the relation is, and since we seem to have more sons then stated, we can't be certain which is which, and its only fair to apply this to the girls as well. Rhavkin (talk) 22:47, March 11, 2018 (UTC)

I think the unknown relation idea might be good. Either that or remove the unknowns completely for the time being. We already know all of them can't be sons, so I don't think we should assume for the daughters either. 22:59, March 11, 2018 (UTC)

I think they should be removed as well. If we can't prove they're Big Mom's kids, then there's also no way to prove that they're related to her at all. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 12:17, May 6, 2018 (UTC)

After reading through the above posts, I think I have a partial solution to this conundrum. Flampe has 41 older brothers, and 36-40 are the Decuplets.We can assume that Anglais, Dolce, and Dragee are all younger then Flampe. There were three unnamed male children among the group in chap 845. So, in my opinion, it stands to reason that one of those male kids is older then Flampe while the other two are younger.

There's actually a perfect number of younger sons. There are only six more after the male Decuplets, and the three unnamed sons (bandages, snakeneck, fishman) plus the three named ones equal six. We can prove that they're her kids through math. (Yeomanaxel (talk) 20:06, June 4, 2018 (UTC))

This all comes down to Pudding's age at the end, but you might be right one of those 3 unnamed sons might be older than Flampe. If Pudding ends up being 17 then one of those 3 unnamed sons would be the 41st son making him 16. Opera298 (talk) 07:03, June 5, 2018 (UTC)

He would be older then Flampe either way, but I think we can definitively prove even that. In chapter 845, Big Mom says (Viz official translation), "Just find a way to get along, my children! Tomorrow is your big sister Pudding's wedding!" She's talking to all of the kids at this point, something the anime makes even clear then the manga did.

So, that means those three unnamed sons are Pudding's younger brothers. Which would make Pudding 17 and the 75th child and the son older then Flampe 16 and the 76th child.

Heck, the ages alone can help us figure out whether they're siblings or not. Big Mom, starting at 18, gave birth for 42 years straight and stopped when she was 60. She is now 68, which means her youngest kid is 8 years old. Flampe is 15, and if we go down the numbers (14, 13, 12, 11, 10, 9, 8,) then there are eight children younger then her. I say eight, even though there are seven numbers, because Dolce and Dragee are twins.

So, of the ten children we see gathered in chap 845, one is older then Flampe, eight are younger, and one is not a child at all. I believe the not-child is the dwarf girl, mainly because I refuse to believe, even in One Piece, that Big Mom could have a relationship with a dwarf. (Yeomanaxel (talk) 13:20, June 5, 2018 (UTC))