Talk:Kuzan

One quick question- The page needs to be on his name, like all the other pages are... but should it be under Kuzan or Aokiji? I'm going for Kuzan since it's actually his name, but I'm not sure... --Murasaki 23:34, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

I think Akainu is under his Admiral name, Akainu, so I say on the Aokiji page. It's his alias, so at the current point in One Piece, his name, according to the government, is Aokiji. That is the name he goes by, he went by it when they first met, and for now his name is Aokiji. his name being Kuzan, I beleive, wasn't revealed until Robin's flashback. Cody2526 23:40, 4 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I don't think Akainu should be used as reference, as they're the only two. XD But I do agree on the point that it's essentially his name, so Aokiji is probably best, with a redirect from Kuzan. ^^ --Murasaki 23:44, 4 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Don't forget, uhh....Yellow Monkey. We know nothing about him,. but we can assume his name was also changed to his new alias. Cody2526 23:44, 4 November 2006 (UTC)
 * But that one's impossible, so obviously we have to use his nickname. Same with Tsuru (yes, it's a nickname. XD) --Murasaki 23:52, 4 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Aokiji is the name most know him by, and the name he uses right now. One-Winged Hawk 23:47, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

Okay, all moved over here, with a redirect from Kuzan to here as well. ^^ --Murasaki 02:33, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

In episode 227 it says aokiji is the most powerful fighter in the marines. is this true?

Aokiji the Orchestrator
There is the reason why I called that. His meeting with the straw hats in Longring Longland island which pulled the string of events that happened in Water 7/Enies Lobby:


 * He scared Robin into doubting and fear the betrayal of her crews


 * He called Spandam and gave him the authority to use the Buster Call


 * Because of him, Robin was "captured" by the CP9 and ends up working with them


 * Because of him that the Straw Hats chased th CP9 all the way to Enies Lobby to rescue Robin

No, I'm not mad. I'm only saying this because I think it proper to call him that.


 * Well, I think it's fine if you want to call him that here... but don't replace the current intro with it, find a way to work it in. Both sets of information are appropriate. --Murasaki 03:23, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

Actor Pic
I saw that we did add the information on the actor Aokiji is based on, but will we put a pic of him too like what Kizaru now has? -StrangerAtaru 18:09, 17 July 2008 (UTC)


 * It's okay I guess but it probably should be the pic with the sleepmask from here. You can upload if you want but be sure to credit the site.Mugiwara Franky 18:19, 17 July 2008 (UTC)

doubt on Robin's past
"The truth is Robin only ran away from people who try to kill her or turn her in, however, these people are still alive." :are there any evidence of this statement? --219.79.198.58 12:36, 19 February 2009 (UTC)Jonathan

Aokiji's history
I believe a huge part of Aokiji's history is wrong. It says that the straw hats met him on longring longland, but they met him on an uninhabited island. and he was lying in front of a rock, not tonjit's house. and he wasn't after the straw hats, he didn't even know where they were, he was just relaxing. and he didn't tell the straw hats robin's past, that was revealed during enies lobby, he didn't even tell them how they knew each other, robin did. SHE said that he tried to capture her once. and he didn't help tonjit and shelly cross the ocean, he helped people that were stranded after their ship was destroyed. I didn't edit it because it might've been following the manga or something (I didn't read the manga). Franky103 09:34, June 24, 2010 (UTC)


 * Yes, the story follows the manga. See Canon. Tipota 12:33, June 24, 2010 (UTC)

Aokiji vs Akainu
Who would win a fight between these two Logia type devil fruit users? (magma can easily melt ice)


 * Umm Forum. Mugiwara Franky 14:39, July 2, 2010 (UTC)

Former vice admiral
Isn't it obvious? Did he went to bed when he was a child someday and woke up the next day saying "I'm an admiral from today"? It's a classic career. Shouldn't we delete those two words at the beginning of the page? --Meganoide 16:11, July 20, 2010 (UTC)

can I add onto the trivia for Aokiji?
Is It okay If I can add on to Aokijis trivia? About him being the only passive admiral to have organized a conspiracy against the StrawHat Pirates? Thekindwellmeaningone 20:58, September 5, 2010 (UTC)


 * Unfortately, no, read Trivia Guidelines for advice on suitable stuff. 94.168.119.106 21:04, September 5, 2010 (UTC)

Is It ok, for me to add onto Aokiji's trivia? About him being the only passive Admiral?
Is It kay, for me to add onto Aokiji's trivia? About him being the only passive Admiral, who is not violent?Iamnofool 21:18, September 23, 2010 (UTC)

We kind of already have that in his personality section, so adding it to trivia would just be repetitive and meaningless.DancePowderer 21:24, September 23, 2010 (UTC)

Why were my edits reverted? They made sense.
Why were my edits reverted? They made logical sense.Iamnofool 01:04, September 24, 2010 (UTC)


 * Statements like


 * "Along with this, he is powerful enough to fight against notably powerful figures such as Diamond Jozu, although to be fair Jozu was distracted by Marco who was hurt, and Jozu was not paying attention to fighting Aokiji; the Third Division Commander of the Whitebeard Pirates, and even Whitebeard himself, although to be fair, Whitebeard was in old age, had been heavily wounded, and wasn't using his devil fruit powers, except when he formed invisble vibrations around himself".


 * are kinda logical I guess, but they kinda only apply to a certain degree. The Jozu one kinda implies that Aokiji was not able to fight against Jozu until that instance when Jozu was distracted. This is kinda wrong as Aokiji was able to match Jozu's attacks prior to that instance.


 * The same also goes for the Whitebeard one. The first one to actually attack Whitebeard was Aokiji. When Aokiji did so, Whitebeard was not only able to counter the attack by Aokiji, but he was also able to lay a strike on Aokiji. All the while, the only disadvantage that Whitebeard had was old age which was not impairing him at the start of the battle. Saying that Aokiji was only able to fight Whitebeard after all the wounds, kinda implies that Aokiji was not able to take the initial counter attack. There's also the fact that Whitebeard used his devil fruit powers more than just vibrating against Aokiji. There was when he sent a shockwave to the execution stand and there was when he tilted the entire island of Marineford. Both instances, affected pretty much alot of people including Aokiji.Mugiwara Franky 06:39, September 24, 2010 (UTC)

Why were my other edits removed? they made sense, so why?
Why were my other edits removed? they made perfect sense, so why?Iamnofool 00:41, September 27, 2010 (UTC)

Possible photo addition?
Is anyone going to add a picture of Aokiji trying to freeze the Heart Pirates as they attempt to escape with Luffy in tow? As the final picture for the Whitebeard War?Iwilllisten 01:10, December 16, 2010 (UTC)

'''Aokiji as the strongest admiral? '''

The quote from the Gorousei was a mistranslation they meant that he part of the strongest marine force.

No Brother.

Shouldn't we remove the thing about Aokiji having a brother? I mean of course he could have a brother, but the source that states the possibility ( Chapter 321, "Sorry Little Bro" ) is actually just when he apologizes to a fish that he bumps in to with his bike? Sopkvazzt 14:52, December 25, 2010 (UTC)

Weird
I always wondered why the translators didnt translate their names completely, Aokiji technicly means "Blue Crane", they do that in the swedish trasnlation, where they call him "BlåTrana". 18:19, April 4, 2011 (UTC)

It sounds strange, plus they want to make it all stay as original as possible. By the way, Aokiji means Blue Pheasant, not Blue Crane. 21:41, April 4, 2011 (UTC)
 * Oh pheasant? Heh, me and my dumb translators. 12:22, April 5, 2011 (UTC)

Article Name
Why was the article name changed to Kuzan? I know that's his real name, but isn't he better known as Aokiji?--Lordxehanort 18:01, May 27, 2011 (UTC)

We had a whole forum for this.. 18:05, May 27, 2011 (UTC)

Because they let a bunch of bloggers vote which made it so that all real names would be allowed. SeaTerror 18:59, May 27, 2011 (UTC)

Sakazuki's Devil Fruit "advantage"
"Furthermore, he was able to combat against fellow admiral Sakazuki on perfectly equal terms despite Sakazuki's Devil Fruit having the advantage over him"

You might want to remove this bit of speculation - especially as the length of their duel, as well as Jinbei's words that their abilities were nigh-perfectly matched (i.e. not that Kuzan's abilities were a bad match against Sakazuki's), strongly suggest that it's nonsense.

78.79.25.237 15:59, February 2, 2012 (UTC) - Wisshard

This probably about by the fact that at Marineford, Akainu was able to easily vaporize ice and melt through the ice platform. I would say that is a disadvantage. However, Jinbe did state they were equally matched, so something better might be "despite the opposing natures of their Devil Fruits." 16:09, February 2, 2012 (UTC)

Saying "despite the opposing natures of their Devil Fruits" implies that the opposing natures of their fruits would make it harder instead of easier for them to stalemate each other (which doesn't make sense). There doesn't even need to be anything in its place since the sentence actually works better without it. Bastian964 16:17, February 2, 2012 (UTC)

All speculation. They were basically equally matched, point. No need to make up stuff like this (keep it to the forums) 16:29, February 2, 2012 (UTC)

How is it speculation? Anyone who took 1st grade chemistry knows that magma is hot, and ice melts when exposed to heat. So, chemically, Kuzan was at a disadvantage. Why is that so hard to accept? 01:05, February 3, 2012 (UTC)

I don't agree... because the magma with enough water (or by lowering the temperature) become stone, so you can say the opposite too. They are opposite powers so the will overwhelm each other depending the power of each attacks (great amount of magma will win over small amount of ice and vice-verse). If what are you saying it's true, then Kuzan should have lost against Ace, but he was evenly matched and in this case the equation  doesn't count, because for ice heat from fire or heat from magma doesn't change much. we should do as Jinbe said.

We don't know if he was at a disadvantage in this battle.. We didn't see them fight at all.. Jinbe said they fought equally.. And they fought for 10 days.. If he had a disadvantage he wouldn't hold up this long.. Its One Piece not reality..

"Anyone who took 1st grade chemistry knows that magma is hot, and ice melts when exposed to heat. So, chemically, Kuzan was at a disadvantage" - DancePowderer

While that is certainly true, Kuzan's  Hie no Mie abilities isn't limited to strictly creating and manipulating ice. For instance, through several of his signature moves, such as Ice Age and Ice Time, he has shown that he also possesses a transcending ability to freeze things he touches. Hence, given the information we have at our disposal, I think it's presumptuous to suggest on the wikia that Kuzan was at a disadvantage against Sakazuki - especially, as I said before, when Jinbe's words and the fact that their duel took 10 days to settle strongly suggest otherwise.

78.79.11.115 00:04, February 12, 2012 (UTC) Wisshard

Well I feel that his devil fruit power was probably at a disadvantage when put against Akainu's but the reason the fight might have lasted 10 days was because Aokiji is a very skilled fighter, smart, & has fought alongside Akainu for many years so he knows how he fights. 420pirate 00:21, February 12, 2012 (UTC)

@DP Because basic chemistry doesn't always work in One Piece, that is why. Especially when it comes to Devil Fruits there is no way of telling which one is superior. This isn't even a matter of interpretation: it came straight out of Crocodiles mouth (probably the most knowledgable character introduced when it comes to Devil Fruits).

So, unless stated otherwise we have no right to apply real life logic here or anywhere else. Weird explanations by Oda like "magma burns fire" only further demonstrates this. 01:01, February 12, 2012 (UTC)

Here are some examples that I think show the Magu Magu no Mi's superiority to the Hie Hie no Mi. 1) At Marineford, Akainu's Ryusei Kazan (magma fist rain, whatever it's called) easily burned through a thick layer of ice and even heated up the water beneath it. 2) When Akainu complained about the ice blocking the seige wall, Kizaru asked Akainu why he didn't just melt it. 3) Hie Hie no Mi matched equally with the Mera Mera no Mi. The Mera Mera no Mi lost to the Magu Magu no Mi. Hie=Mera, MeraHie.

If you disagree with this, then I still think that we should say "conflicting devil fruits" or "mismatched natures of their abilities" or something. This isn't that big a deal. 02:42, February 12, 2012 (UTC)

There is no need to say anything more than what is already on the page. The bit about Akuinu supposely having an advantage was not only speculation, it turned the sentence into something of a run on. As it is right now the sentence works fine, no speculation required. And as Jinbe quoted from Crocidile "there is no way of telling which one is superior" without being told. Bastian964 03:52, February 12, 2012 (UTC)

Agree with the IP (and Bastian, Jinbe, Levi, and LPK). (By the way, PX, your examples 1 and 2 just show that Akainu is stronger than ice. That was expected. But they do not prove that Aokiji is unable to freeze Akainu.)

The powers of Aokiji listed on this page said that whether his speed was attributed to Soru or his Devil Fruit ability is unkown. I have editted it to say that he definitely uses his ice power for his speed, and possibly uses a combination of Soru and his ice ability to move at high speeds. I have decided this due to the ice spike left behind whenever he moves faster than the eye can see. I believe this is significant proof that he uses his ice ability when moving at high speeds.

I would have to agree with some of the above posts. Though intuitively we would assume that magma is more powerful against ice than ice is against magma, this is the one piece world, not reality. It all depends on how cold the creator has made Kuzan's Ice, and how hot the creator has made Akainu's Magma. It is possible that he made Akainu's magma just as hot as Kuzan's Ice is cold, leading to a faily equal match in abilities despite real world assumptions about their fight,This would explain the 10 day battle, and near stalemate of their battle, as the creator (Sorry I don't know his name) has highly connoted an equal footing in their fight.
 * That is pure unconfirmed speculation, and you should not add information like that to our articles. Also, please sign your posts. 13:43, October 30, 2012 (UTC)

Gallery
wasn't there a picture that shows Aokiji's scars and all? why did it get deleted FirePit (talk) 17:06, January 21, 2013 (UTC)

Infobox fault?
Hi, just viewed the Kuzan-page and saw that in the infobox before timeskip and after timeskip are overlapping each other. Does somebody how to fix that? Zoeyua (talk) 17:22, February 5, 2013 (UTC)
 * Yeah that happens to me too, though I am not so proficent on this Wikia "yet", that I know how to fix it. WonderfulUnicorn (talk) 18:25, February 5, 2013 (UTC)

The problem was created by Switch infobox if the image was thinner then the tabs width. It should be solved now.
 * Thanks Levi ^_^ WonderfulUnicorn (talk) 18:51, February 5, 2013 (UTC)

There is no anime image
I think it's an obvious course of action to remove the Film Z photo of Kuzan from the infobox. That's not a screencap from the anime, it's concept art and Kuzan already made his debut in the manga so we should wait until the anime gets to that point in Punk Hazard to add an anime version. M4ND0N (talk) 22:33, February 5, 2013 (UTC)

That image isn't actually concept art, and it was used in Film Z. Film Z is technically anime, so that is an anime appearance. Granted, the image can be much better, but it's the best we got right now. 22:37, February 5, 2013 (UTC)

True enough, I don't think we need to wait for Punk Hazard. But I think if we replaced it with an actual screencap of Kuzan from Film Z it would be a lot better, quality-wise. Even though it's from the movie, that particular photo was never actually used in the movie, although it was used to promote it. But the only high res photo of Kuzan is from the trailer so I guess we'll have to wait until the movie's released on DVD to get a full-body photo. M4ND0N (talk) 22:40, February 5, 2013 (UTC)

Movie isn't out yet in torrent form, but it'll get done when it is. 22:42, February 5, 2013 (UTC)

Though if the anime comes out with a better version of him, that version will definetly be used over the Film Z version. But only time will tell of that. 22:48, February 5, 2013 (UTC)

Won't happen. 22:49, February 5, 2013 (UTC)

Toei's art stinks lately, I think any version from a movie would be superior to something Toei could puke out after Punk Hazard's over.. but that's just my opinion, since Film Z has some of the best art I've seen in a One Piece film. M4ND0N (talk) 22:52, February 5, 2013 (UTC)

Toei "puked out" Film Z. 22:53, February 5, 2013 (UTC)

I'm aware, but obviously the production value for a movie is higher than something they need to produce on a weekly basis. M4ND0N (talk) 23:00, February 5, 2013 (UTC)

If there's no movie around when Kuzan appears at this point in the anime, Toei might have a better budget and production value to animate him better. Of course, this is a big might. 23:16, February 5, 2013 (UTC)

Unlikely. The budget won't increase just because there's no movie. Sure, the quality won't be as crappy as FI, but unless the ratings really start to drop, they won't have to increase the budget. 23:19, February 5, 2013 (UTC)