Talk:Chapter 788

Summary War
OK, so me and Mega are feuding on aspects of the Long Summary which he thought were unnecessary. He deleted several parts of it, some of which I am OK with and some I think need to stay. However, he has made it clear that he doesn't want to see ANY of the parts he deleted restored. Since this has turned into an edit war, I figured this would be the best place to talk about it.

Summary points of contention:
 * "Doflamingo turns toward them and reiterates his original promise, that if they captured Luffy he would free them." This was a major interaction between him and the gladiators that was certainly different from him just murdering them. We don't know if he was serious about it, but it is still a major interaction.
 * "Meanwhile, the gladiators accompanying Gatz tell him that the Birdcage will start killing people before Luffy recovers his Haki, but Gatz says that he would not send Luffy out while the pirate was in no condition to fight." Again, this was a major piece of dialogue in the chapter and it helped illustrate the severity of the situation in the chapter. I don't understand how this is unnecessary filler.

Call me OCD, but I feel that these parts of the summary are good and don't need to be cut out as "filler," since they are not filler. I don't like Long Summaries that are too long either, but nor do I support cutting facts that could be considered as important. That is my stance. Mega, please be civil if/when you give your side of the argument 22:36, May 28, 2015 (UTC)

Ok, I'm getting real tired of these more and more frequent arguments. You're all getting really antsy over any kind of edit like this. Please focus on the content, not the editors involved.

The first sentence is fine, the second could use some shortening, but is fine otherwise. 23:27, May 28, 2015 (UTC)

The first sentence is useless since Dofy talks with no use characters and he immediately doesn't give them the possibility to ally with him. A random sentence who Oda added just to fill the image with a baloon. The second one is necessary? Gatz only says "it's useless that Luffy restarts to fight until he is ready". Oh thank you Gatz, thank you Kaido! --Meganoide (talk) 17:54, May 29, 2015 (UTC)

All of the content as is is fine. There's nothing wrong with it. SeaTerror (talk) 17:55, May 29, 2015 (UTC)

SeatError, only serious opinions are allowed, do you remember it? You talk always against me, so there is no interest in reading your opinions. And I add: what the f*** is the meaning of just saying "they're fine"? Kaido is already saying it. Bring some proof or just stay quiet. This is not a personal attack, only a fact. You're saying nothing new? Then just be silent. C'mon, start attacking me accusing me of being rude only because I underline the fact that your behaviour is illogical. It's your only reason for your edits, right? Meganoide (talk) 18:01, May 29, 2015 (UTC)

Doubt my opinion holds much weight, but I have to say I agree with at least the second one staying. I read the mangastream version, so what I saw was a little different. In the version I read, for the first one, the gladiators run up on Doffy and he says "You idiots sure are thick. This is me asking politely....bring me Straw Hat NOW." Then he proceeds to fuck them all up. He essentially just did the exact same thing to different fodder last chapter (minus the asking "politely") so I can agree that the first one doesn't add much to the summary, but I don't think it hurts it either. If anything you could have just paraphrased a little.

As for the 2nd instance, I definitely think it should stay. But once again, I read a different translation. Gatz comment in Mangastream was "How can I throw a contender that can't fight into the ring?" In my opinion, any interaction that reveals or confirms something to us about a known character is significant. Before all this shit went down, no one thought much of Gatz. Because of the bias he often took as an announcer in the colosseum, I think a lot of people wrote him off as just another one of Mingo's cronies. Him showing up to help Luffy in his most dire time of need (before any other SH at that) shows exactly where his heart lies, and that he wants the country to be free from Mingo just as much as anyone else, even being willing to risk his life to put all his faith in Luffy. To me, his question this chapter confirmed his sense of honor. It was hinted at slightly when they calling for Rebecca's head after she won block D, and he stated that they already give her the lowest quality everything. Theoretically, this would be an instance that would show up on Gatz page: either in his personality section, or history section, or both actually. So that alone to me makes it worth it. HanataSanchou (talk) 18:21, May 29, 2015 (UTC)

If I mean it then it's a serious opinion. SeaTerror (talk) 19:07, May 29, 2015 (UTC)

The length of summary's shouldn't matter. I agree with Kaido's comments, that the parts MegaError has removed aren't filler. 19:31, May 29, 2015 (UTC)

Hanata, I agree that it must be placed in Gatz's personality, but not here. SeaT, your comment added nothing ---> you should have been silent. You're just trolling. Besty, now I'm MegaError? That nickname shows that you feel hurt. Gatz's sentence is useless in this page. Meganoide (talk) 19:36, May 29, 2015 (UTC)

That isn't true at all. If my comment added nothing then there would be no comment. According to a site what I posted added 150 total characters (including sig). SeaTerror (talk) 19:46, May 29, 2015 (UTC)

It's true. I'm hurt, I'm hurt knowing you have caused yet another stupid and pointless edit war. 20:19, May 29, 2015 (UTC)

From edit war to talk page war. This kind of behavior will not be tolerated.

Anyway, I agree with JSD; the second point could use some minor trimming. Otherwise, they're certainly important enough to be mentioned in the summary. 20:41, May 29, 2015 (UTC)

About the Gatz sentence, maybe it's important in the chapter, maybe not, I think the point is that you shouldn't summarize the chapter text, but what happens. And what happens is that Gatz still holds Rufy. I don't really get why people always feel the need to write what people tell each other, like "Meanwhile, the gladiators accompanying Gatz tell him that the Birdcage will start killing people before Luffy recovers his Haki" - the gladiators are all captains obvious and are stating what's happening... is really necessary to write that in the summary? Why writing everytime what people tell each other instead of telling what happens? We are not summarizing the script of the chapter, we are summarizing the events of the chapter. Sure, sometimes you have to write those things like when Robin reveals that Shiraoshi is poseidon, but sometimes. The part "but Gatz says that he would not send Luffy out while the pirate was in no condition to fight" just tell that Gatz still wants to hold Luffy, basically nothing happens since the situation is not changed from before. If you want to mention that, you can simply write that or you may just as well skip it.

Alright, this got nuts, but I'll throw my hat into the ring on several issues:

First, it's totally alright to just say "___ is fine" on a talk page, provided that you don't come just to repeat it again and again over the course of an argument. Opinions should be respected, and without knowing the opinions of users we could never reach the "clear majority" needed to close a talk page. Not everyone needs to (or wants to) post a short novel on a talk page. Many people don't even want to post on talk pages at all, we need to take and respect what we can get. What you are advocating for Meganoide, is essentially "voter suppression", the one thing I want to make sure never happens on this wiki.

Second off, ST was not the only one to essentially post "___ is fine" on this talk page. In fact, I was the first. Judging him for saying that but nobody else is quite unfair and just speaks to a deep-seated personal bias you have against ST, Mega, which is definitely clouding your judgement and is why you are banned now.

Lastly, about the actual content: If the interactions just focused on the responses of background characters, I would say remove it, but all of the dialogue is from major characters. It is the duty of the long summary to cover all of the important parts of the chapter, and since these parts include major characters, we should mention them. They would never pass the test for short summaries, and each really should be kept as short as possible, but they both deserve to remain. Especially the Gatz one, as the way I understand it, it's one of the emotional high points of the chapter, and of Gatz's personal achievements. 04:47, May 31, 2015 (UTC)