Talk:Chapter 977

Wanda
Wanda appear on the second page in the second panel, on the right behind Brook. Source:. Now this is an English based wiki, based on the English release, and Wanda does not appear in the English release since the panel is cropped differently. She also doe not appear in the raw. So should she be included?

If so, that means that from now on, and if possible any past chapter, should be viewed in both official languages, to see if there are other revealed information. I suggest waiting for the volume release, that usually also crop some panels differently then the magazine release. Any objections? Rhavkin (talk) 20:57, April 13, 2020 (UTC)

I think the problem is simply that most scans cropped a tiny bit, and the Spanish release kept it uncropped, revealing the missing Wanda. It's possible this is not the first time this has happened. Could it be because she's in the spine of the magazine? I dunno but I would like to see if she's there in the physical version. That would explain Klobis' possible confusion. 06:41, April 14, 2020 (UTC)

I think waiting for the volume releases is a good and safe idea, especially for checking older chapters, but for future ones i think there's no reason for us to not check both versions, since at the end of the day what matters is the original art, unfortunate cropping is just that, unfortunate. Doomroar (talk) 20:58, April 14, 2020 (UTC)

You can see her in full view in this image posted on the official Japanese One Piece Instagram account. She's in the chapter, she should be included. DewClamChum (talk) 23:15, April 14, 2020 (UTC)

No one is questioning her being there. The Spanish version doesn't add thing without reason, but the fact that it was on on one version this wiki doesn't go by, and missing from the two it does is crucial.

Think of it like this, on Wanda page, if we'd add her being there when Jinbe rejoin the crew, we'd reference it, and when the reference will be searched, Wanda wouldn't be there in most acceptable sources, with the exception of the volume release. 10:09, April 15, 2020 (UTC)

You can see at least her hat and shoulder in every version of the chapter. It doesn't matter if it's recognizably her, she's there. I don't know what you're talking about when you say "we're an english-based wiki based on the english release." That isn't true. The information on the wiki is first sourced from the Japanese material. It doesn't matter if she was cropped out of the english release, she's in the chapter. DewClamChum (talk) 10:16, April 15, 2020 (UTC)

A previews edit was removed, where I brought up the raw as well. What I meant is we go by the official release in which Wanda does not appear. Without the Spanish release and\or the full panel, we can't say it is Wanda. Rhavkin (talk) 10:31, April 15, 2020 (UTC)

At the end of the day it is a fact that Wanda is on the ship, i agree with DewClamChum, even when she is cropped out you can see her hat and shoulder, and what matters in the end is the japanese version, the original, the source, and in there we can see her entire body. Like i said before what matters is the original art, and in the original art Wanda is in there. This wiki is not english based, a lot of content referenced in here hasn't even been translated in english and chances are it will never get an official translation, but it exist in its native format, and as such we should take it into account, if the english versions has unfortunate mistakes on it, that doesn't means we should have them too, specially when we have the oportunity to correct them. Doomroar (talk) 08:51, April 16, 2020 (UTC)

Wanda is in the chapter. And we can prove it.

It shouldn't be that complicated. One just needs to note the cropping. Maybe in the Trivia section. Or an asterisk note.KingCannon (talk) 10:30, April 16, 2020 (UTC)

She appeared, so she's included. Do what KingCannon said and add an asterisk or trivia note. Trivia would probably be best. 03:26, April 18, 2020 (UTC)

We don't put trivia sections on chapters or episode articles. SeaTerror (talk) 07:01, April 18, 2020 (UTC)

She doesn't appear in the official English, nor the raw. How is that different from characters that were hidden behind a text bubble? Even if we knew they are there, and even if they do appear in the corresponding episode, if they do not appear in the chapter, they are not included in the table. Cropping is usually fixed in the volume release, and even then, it goes in the volume changes section. Rhavkin (talk) 04:40, April 24, 2020 (UTC)

She doesn't appears in the pirated leaked raw, but the actual raw shows her perfectly fine, hell in this very page you can see the original panel itself, just as the official Spanish version which also has better quality images does, this is completelly different than a character being obscured on speech bubble, this is the original art straight out being tampered with. Doomroar (talk) 21:10, April 25, 2020 (UTC)

She doesn't appears in any version of the released raw except the original panel from tweeter, the quality is irrelevant to the topic, and how are two cases of characters we know are present but are unseen or just partly seen "completely different"? Rhavkin (talk) 04:41, April 26, 2020 (UTC)

It need not matter that Wanda can't be seen in the English version or even the raw. As long as she can be proven to have been originally in the chapter through whatever mechanism, she should be counted, whether that means on this page or having her history expanded to include this chapter on her page. It's hard to justify proclaiming a character was not there when there is visual evidence that they were.Nightmare Pirates (talk) 07:38, July 1, 2020 (UTC)

There's a clear majority to add her especially with the proof already given. SeaTerror (talk) 17:32, July 1, 2020 (UTC)

Sooooo, back to talk page, since there is no agreement in the editing history. A good compromise is listing her, but with an explanation asterisk.Nightmare Pirates (talk) 23:34, July 5, 2020 (UTC)

The agreement was to already list her. It's just Rhavkin going against consensus again. All you need is the asterisk and the explanation under chapter notes since we don't use status that way. SeaTerror (talk) 06:06, July 6, 2020 (UTC)

Volume
Completely gone in the volume... Just saying. Rhavkin (talk) 16:54, September 21, 2020 (UTC)

The volume cropped Wanda out, it did not erase her. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 17:17, September 21, 2020 (UTC)

She doesn't appear in any medium the wiki consider acceptable. Rhavkin (talk) 17:30, September 21, 2020 (UTC)

Oda himself drew her in the chapter so why would it not be acceptable? He did not personally remove her, the publisher cropped her out because of space constraints. What Oda does > what the publisher does. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 17:44, September 21, 2020 (UTC)

Oda wanted Nami to be an axe wielding cyborg and that Zoro would be part of Buggy's crew. Final product > Concepts. Rhavkin (talk) 17:53, September 21, 2020 (UTC)

Wanda is in the final product, as evidenced by her presence in the Spanish release. She is only missing from the Japanese and English publications because of cropping, not because of any alterations by Oda. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 17:59, September 21, 2020 (UTC)

Does she appear on the official English release? No. Does she appear on the official Japanese release? No. Does she appear on the Japanese volume release? No. Is there any other source this wiki based it's information and articles content on? Rhavkin (talk) 18:27, September 21, 2020 (UTC)

Oda. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 18:52, September 21, 2020 (UTC)

Who drew an image that wasn't in any of the official release this wiki use for credible source. It is a drawing by Oda that is similar to a penal from a chapter. Nothing more. Rhavkin (talk) 19:29, September 21, 2020 (UTC)

Sometimes things are cropped differently, doesn't mean they were never meant to be there or Oda suddenly decided to change his mind and get rid of them. By your logic, Potaufeu's entire page and appearance would be non-canon because his face never appeared in the English or Japanese versions, but appeared in Chinese version only, much like Wanda in the Spanish version.Nightmare Pirates (talk) 21:01, September 21, 2020 (UTC)

Potaufeu was seen in the chapter in all versions, he was just obscured, and yes most of his appearance is based on the anime but we hardly consider appearances non-canon, we just the difference ("...wear red coat (blue in the anime)..."). By your logic, for every new chapter we need to read all translation and any difference is acceptable to be noted. Rhavkin (talk) 04:04, September 22, 2020 (UTC)

That is perfectly fine. There is rarely any real difference between the standard Japanese/English cropped release and the more uncropped versions that some publishers use. If the cropped versions leave a character out, we will note it because for all intents and purposes Oda included them in his final artwork. Instances like these are not a result of the creator "correcting" or changing anything, they simply happen because of technical constraint decisions on the publisher's end. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 04:58, September 22, 2020 (UTC)

If I remember correctly, we see Wanda's hat in the official releases. In other words, she is there, but likewise, obscured.Nightmare Pirates (talk) 05:04, September 22, 2020 (UTC)