Talk:Logia

I don't know what you guys are thinking not talking about this at all but you're all odd. People need to get something straight here. This is the only fruit with out essays written about it. And yet it's the most powerful and by far the coolest class of devils fruit. And this is the first

Here I'll start it off if you guys are that lazy:

- Kizaru is the fastest - What would happen if Kizaru and Blackbeard had it out? - What would happen if Mr 0/Crocodile was in a fight with Enel? - Is there a water fruit?

See it isn't that hard. Just watch some past eps and start there.

~Daniel Sep. 8th.


 * I don't see what you're talking about. The page has just as much info as the other fruit types.


 * As for your sentence suggestions, most are questions whose answers can only give speculations. The Kizaru thing is true to some point since light is extremely fast but is it really necessary?Mugiwara Franky 08:04, September 8, 2009 (UTC)

I just meant the discussion page should be filled with more than nothing like it has been. This is a great aspect of the series and it's just a shame to see that it doesn't have people talking about it like they should be. I just think that people should be fully using the discussion pages other than for just change complaints and things of those nature that's all. Plus what's the harm in openly discussing speculation? I see no harm in that. Like I said this is a discussino page for a reason right?

~Daniel Sep 8. 12:24


 * The talk pages of the articles are generally meant to be used to discuss the various aspects of a page amongst the various contributors. Things like verifying the source of info, character name spelling, views on what is the correct info among editors, and other stuff like that are what are generally supposed to be in the talk page. It's a place where editors can talk to one another and try to understand each other so there won't be edit wars and the page can be properly maintained.


 * The stuff you wish to talk about unfortunately doesn't belong here. They kinda belong in a forum where stuff like that can be discussed. If it was regularly discussed in the article talk pages, then more important issues like spelling, confirmation, and overall article status would be overlooked. If you really wish to have a place to talk about such stuff, try Arlong Park Forums.Mugiwara Franky 16:45, September 8, 2009 (UTC)

Jinbei and Whitebeard overcoming the Logia weakness?
It states that Rayleigh, Hancock, Whitebeard, Jinbei, and Marco were all capable of overcoming the Logia weakness in order to harm them. Now, Rayleigh and Hancock are obvious through the use of Haki, but Marco didn't really harm Kizaru with his Phoenix powers, did he? I dunno, I just think that should be amended. As for Whitebeard and Jinbei, I don't remember them ever actually harming Logia types. Is it possible for there to be some kind of source included to prove these claims? Otherwise, you know, it's obvious that they should be removed. Subrosian 04:36, October 17, 2009 (UTC)

Excuse me, let me correct that. It says that Marco, Whitebeard, and Jinbei were able to nullify their Logia powers. Marco's I understand, so strike that from the record. But, Whitebeard and Jinbei, I still don't recall them nullifying anyone's Logia powers. Subrosian 04:38, October 17, 2009 (UTC)

What?! He beat the hell out of Ace post eating his fruit in that flashback.

~Daniel 12.18

Yeah, and Whitebeard beat thecrap out of Akainu. he couldn't have hit him without haki. And with Kizaru, if he was intangible when Marco kicked him, he wouldn't have been sent flying. He is just durable.

~Pacifista15 10.48

Well Whitebeard has his shock wave that he uses and it seems like it doesn't matter what your made of if something that big and powerful hits you, your going to move. I suppose.

~that guy

as for Marco attacking Akainu, I think its pretty safe to say that logia that have haki themselves are able to resist haki attacks to a point. or at least reduce the lethality of the damage.173.238.152.107 08:15, February 2, 2011 (UTC)

Water Logia Fruit
is there a water devil fruit? then will the person eating the devil fruit able to swim and weaken other devil fruit user 202.152.82.169 00:04, December 22, 2009 (UTC)hakim


 * There are no water fruit and no seastone fruit. These fruits are impossible becuase liqud water is the weakness of all DF users. El Chupacabra 15:12, December 22, 2009 (UTC)


 * There is a non-canon anime Logia fruit called the Toro Toro no Mi. It however turns the user into a liquid that's not specifically water.Mugiwara Franky 16:19, December 22, 2009 (UTC)

Haki being the true damage effect?
I don't know why we're already saying that haki is the main source of doing damage to them when it's never ever ever been said how Rayliegh pulled that off against Kizaru. Or how Boa hurt Smoker. And it's really pissing me the fuck off that people think it is Haki that's allowing for that too happen.

~Daniel 12.27.09


 * Dear Dan... Can't you sign your posts properly ~ please.


 * Anyway I'm not going to get started on the haki argument, we've zero from Oda on it in SBS as far as I can tell. One-Winged Hawk 09:28, December 28, 2009 (UTC)


 * The thing is that it appears to be only reasonable explanation why certain people are capable of doing things. For Rayleigh, Haki seems to be the only reason for two things 1) Rayleigh is a known Haki user and 2) Kizaru is a guy who can turn into light, a substance which can't be easily countered.


 * For Hancock, it's actually been stated in the very chapter that it was Haki when she hit Smoker.Mugiwara Franky 10:30, December 28, 2009 (UTC)

Akainu's devil fruit
I have read in many spanish fansites, Akainu's fruit as the "Yogan Yogan no mi".


 * Okay, but until we get confirmation from a reliable source (i.e. Oda), there's no way to tell if this is actually true, no matter how many fansites you've heard it on. 2xN 14:08, May 22, 2010 (UTC)

repeat inormation
Other information now repeats whats already written since someone updated "Strengths" and "weaknesses" without updating "Other...". Can someone correct this, I'm limited on what I can do until tomorrow and I have a task to fulfill tomorrow. 94.168.119.106 20:22, September 11, 2010 (UTC)

Dodge attacks by "becoming their element"?
This is kind of getting on my nerves, you're saying that they have to become their element to dodge bullets/sword slashes etc?

Well please explain this, why do the "hole" which they dodge with create the second the bullets hit their body? It's clear that they don't have to do anything, and no one can even react in their sleep, since they are unconscious.

The only reasonable explanation I could have to this is that they have 3 different levels of the "transform"

1. Not being their element. - NO HAKI REQUIRED

2. Being in human form but they cant touch anything and can't be touched, since they are their element. - HAKI REQUIRED

2.5. "How do they stand on the ground?" They choose to only make some parts of their body invulnerable.

3. Being "transformed", clearly showing their element, and making their element visible. - DOES HAKI WORK?

Please, can someone explain this?

85.225.61.9 03:44, July 14, 2011 (UTC)Sewil

Logia abilities can be trained to be used reflexively so that the body can react to attacks unconsciously, how they are trained is unknown. 03:49, July 14, 2011 (UTC)

Controlling the element not generated from the body
I would appreciate a reference concerning this paragraph:

"A minor weakness is that Logia users can only control their elements when generated from themselves, and not if it is in another state of matter, meaning that they cannot control their respective elements if it was not generated from their bodies. However, this could be bypassed by simply mixing their own element with a pre-existing amount of the particular element in order to augment the strength of the attack (as Crocodile did with his sandstorms). Yet, this only works if there already is a substantial elemental source, such as a desert or an expanse of water."

Could anyone provide one? Else I will remove it from the article.

Thanks! 14:27, July 15, 2011 (UTC)

I don't think it has ever been seen a logia user using anything else but the element that is generated from their body, so I think that is correct.

Sewil 16:54, July 16, 2011 (UTC)

I do have to agree. I'm thinking about Crocodile fighting Luffy in the tomb. There was no sand and he didn't have time to break down any rock, so he had to rely on what his own body could produce. 16:59, July 16, 2011 (UTC)

@ Sewil

Thing is, only because we didn't see it doesn't mean they can't.

Example: Up until recently only humans were seen using devil fruits, but we didn't state that devil fruits only work on humans.

I don't have anything against the theory itself, but articles are holy ground and without a proper reference, this paragraph is material for blogs and forums. The fact that there isn't a single reference kinda proofs that it is fanon. 17:20, July 16, 2011 (UTC)

It was never stated, but it was demonstrated. The first time was with Crocodile, the second time was with Ace fighting Teach. He set something on fire and then drew the flames back to his body. Also if this wasn't true, then Kizaru would be the most overpowered character in the series. Light is everywhere, yet he didn't manipulate it at Sabaody and Marineford. 17:29, July 16, 2011 (UTC)

I don't understand the Crocodile example, yes he used his own sand in the tomb, because there was none. How does this prove that he can't control sand in general? There was no sand for him to control and so he couldn't prove it.

And Ace, flames drawing back to his body? If that was anime only it isn't canon anyway. And for Kizaru, that is really pure speculation. We don't know how his powers exactly work, maybe he did gather the sunlight around him to enhance his attacks. Thats the problem really, this discussion here sounds like its from a blog or a forum. References is what its all about, especially when it concerns fundamental workings of OP. 17:34, July 16, 2011 (UTC)

Ace retracting his flames is canon. As for Kizaru's light, it was seen coming out from his finger, not being collected at the tip, whenever he was about to do a laser attack. 17:41, July 16, 2011 (UTC)

Okay, lets say Ace retracting his flames is canon, even if I doubt it. It still doesn't prove that he can not control flames that didn't came out of his body, since it was all his.

What we need is an example of a logia-user that could not make use of the element outside of his body. How would you formulate such a reference? 17:52, July 16, 2011 (UTC)

@DancePowderer

I just finished Episode 325, seeing the flames he retracted was created from his own body, with the skill "Fire Fist", so that is fire produced from his own Devil Fruit.

And to manipulate the element outside ones body would be too much overpower, so I don't think Oda would accept that, btw how do you do that template thingy? Sewil 18:15, July 16, 2011 (UTC)

I found one. Aokiji's Ice Ball. It's a ranged attack, but if you follow the vapor trail, it leads back to his body. He couldn't just freeze the air x feet away. <http://www.mangareader.net/103-41586-6/one-piece/chapter-567.html/p 18:20, July 16, 2011 (UTC)


 * Well, air is not freezable anyway. Here Aokiji just sends his own ice towards Whitebeard. That does not prove he can't control ice he didn't made. The paragraph is totally speculative, in my opinion. And even more serious, it's stated with much detail, as if it was a well-known thing...

That's partly why we're hesitant to get rid of it. It's written too well to be by some random. Whoever wrote it knew what he/she was talking about. So, giving them the benefit of the doubt, we thought it was worth looking into. Also, I didn't mean he was freezing the air, I meant he was freezing the moisture in the air. 01:47, July 17, 2011 (UTC)


 * Aokiji can freeze the sea, the sea is not produced by Aokiji, myth busted?
 * 03:48, July 17, 2011 (UTC)

Not even close. The question here is a matter of indirect contact. Kuzan was touching the water when he froze it. 03:51, July 17, 2011 (UTC)


 * Wasn't the question whether a Logia user can or cannot "control their elements when generated from themselves"? Damn, that cracks my last post... so hmm... got to think this one over.
 * 03:56, July 17, 2011 (UTC)