Talk:Vinsmoke Judge

Name
Everyone prefers Jajji to Judge? Jajji is not a word; it is Japanese pronunciation. --Klobis (talk) 05:29, July 14, 2016 (UTC)

Then move it to Judge. 05:56, July 14, 2016 (UTC)

We should keep Jajji. It stays consistant with San+ji and Yon+ji (and probably Ichi+ji and Ni+ji too). We should simply keep the spelling sounding like "Judge" in the Trivia.

81.33.215.117 07:51, July 14, 2016 (UTC)

Yeah, I think Jajji is a safer bet. 10:26, July 14, 2016 (UTC)

ジャッジ does translate to "Judge" so I think his name should be Judge. I don't see a trend with the "-ji" in the Vinsmoke Family Meshack (talk) 10:51, July 14, 2016 (UTC)

@Meshack: Because the ones who have the "-ji" name are guys (like AWC said).

Everybody else: We have this same romanization issue with choosing between Purin and Pudding but with the awkward spelling in English, this one just favors "Judge".

We could also go with "Judji" if we want to keep both the judge pun and consistency with the obvious Vinsmoke name pattern. 12:19, July 14, 2016 (UTC)

I won't go into the culinary semantics of why we kept it Purin, but it wasn't a romanization issue completely. I would be tempted to keep it Jajji if his name were a number pun like Sanji and Yonji, but that does not seem to be the case. As Klobis said, Jajji isn't a word, it's a pronunciation of Judge; just like how Basukabiru isn't a word, but a pronunciation of the character Baskerville, whose name is also a real word. We shouldn't assume that the father's name follows the same pattern as his sons'. It should be Judge. 01:19, July 15, 2016 (UTC)

What DancePowderer said Meshack (talk) 01:32, July 15, 2016 (UTC)

Judge works for me. And as ever if it gets romanised we can change it back.

13:19, July 15, 2016 (UTC)

I prefer Jajji or Judji. It keeps in the j pattern. 15:34, July 15, 2016 (UTC)

Judge sounds phonetically awkward. We have no proof that the father's name is or isn't supposed to follow the naming theme of the male Vinsmokes. We should keep it as Jajji until the Viz translation on Monday or until an official romanization shows up. 73.46.0.4 17:20, July 15, 2016 (UTC)

It is possible that the father's name is supposed to be "judge" and is supposed to follow the naming theme of the male Vinsmokes (he is the father, so one can let it slide that he is not a numbered offspring), though the pun would only work in Japanese ("Judji" being a halfway point).--Sandwichman2449 (talk) 20:01, July 18, 2016 (UTC)

If you read the section, more prefer Judge over Jajji because Jajji isn't a word and Jajji is Judge. The others want Jajji because Sanji and Yonji have "-ji" Meshack (talk) 20:07, July 18, 2016 (UTC)

I did read the section.--Sandwichman2449 (talk) 20:24, July 18, 2016 (UTC)

I lean more towards "Judge" over "Jajji", as it conveys his position of authority. The "#-ji/ju" theme could be specific to Sanji's generation, like how the Neptune family's theme of "-boshi/hoshi" is specific to Shirahoshi's.

We could put in the trivia section how the literal romanization of his name somewhat follows the his kids' theme.
 * 海賊☠姫 (talk) 20:45, July 18, 2016 (UTC)

I didn't really have an opinion on this earlier but I think Judge is better. It's not like we use Rufi or Kyarotto, "-ji" suffix aside. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 21:19, July 18, 2016 (UTC)

Just to clarify, in Japanese, his name perfectly follows the "ジ" pattern. Sanji サンジ, Yonji ヨンジ, Jajji/Judji/Judge ジャッジ. 21:40, July 18, 2016 (UTC)

Jajji is better than Judge especially as shown by JOP. SeaTerror (talk) 21:42, July 18, 2016 (UTC)

Well, Viz uses Judge rather than Jajji as I thought. How do we come to a consensus on which one to use? I prefer Judge Meshack (talk) 01:21, July 19, 2016 (UTC)

It's pretty even, and given the compelling arguments for both sides we may have to poll. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 01:31, July 19, 2016 (UTC)

Well one is translated by a white guy from America and the other is translated by an actual Japanese person. SeaTerror (talk) 01:53, July 19, 2016 (UTC)

Judge still has the same ending as Sanji and Yonji in Japanese even if you use Judge over Jajji and Jajji is Judge. I'm okay with a poll as Kaido suggested Meshack (talk) 05:12, July 19, 2016 (UTC)

It's not like if we don't name the article "Judge", that certain interpretation would be lost. It would still be right there in the infobox as the official eng translation and also in the trivia. Until Oda confirms that the spelling actually is Judge, I think it's more important to keep the name spellings consistent as they clearly are in Japanese. 16:06, July 19, 2016 (UTC)

On Purin's page (or Pudding) someone claimed that Oda doesn't use the English word for pudding so it should stay purin and that's okay. Well, Oda uses the English word Judge but some want to trust two unreliable fan translations. See the hypocrisy here? Meshack (talk) 17:42, July 19, 2016 (UTC)

No he didn't. If he used the English word judge then we would be using it. SeaTerror (talk) 18:01, July 19, 2016 (UTC)

So, this "ジャッジ"is not the use of the English word for judge? Meshack (talk) 18:42, July 19, 2016 (UTC)


 * Ok to hell with this delaying, let's just poll it.


 * 19:14, July 19, 2016 (UTC)

That's katakana, not English. SeaTerror (talk) 21:16, July 19, 2016 (UTC)

Lol. I know that's katakana. I just worded my phrase incorrectly then Meshack (talk) 21:45, July 19, 2016 (UTC)

Does... does ST think that Oda runs Mangastreams? 22:36, July 19, 2016 (UTC)

Wat. SeaTerror (talk) 22:44, July 19, 2016 (UTC)

Just so you know, Stephen of Viz didn't even consider the possibility of Jajji until after he translated it. But he decided Judge was still better since it made more sense to his intended audience.

(Although I will point out that Klobis supports Judge as well, and he's Japanese) Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 23:14, July 19, 2016 (UTC)

JOP is also Japanese and said Jajji. SeaTerror (talk) 00:50, July 20, 2016 (UTC)

Yeah, I was pointing out that it wasn't simply an issue of Japanese since two Japanese people have different opinions. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 00:51, July 20, 2016 (UTC)

I asked Stephen why he uses Judge over Jajji and he replied saying that Judge suits him better than Jajji does and he doesn't care what fan translations use Meshack (talk) 07:37, July 20, 2016 (UTC)

Poll Discussion
Poll is set up (thanks, Nova.) Voting will begin tomorrow unless there are any serious objections. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 19:19, July 19, 2016 (UTC)

Is Judji out of the question? 22:53, July 19, 2016 (UTC)

Forgot about that possibility, added it. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 23:14, July 19, 2016 (UTC)

Judji is just a made up name for the character to try to neutrialize the situation. I wouldn't have it as a choice Meshack (talk) 02:54, July 20, 2016 (UTC)

Haki
The page claims he used haki in the fight against Sanji, but it didn't seem that way to me. He simply used his cape to guard himself and both the cape and his arm actually caught on fire. 15:56, July 21, 2016 (UTC)

Its say haki because his cape turned black. And when did it caught on fire? The flames ware from Sanji's attack and a few seconds later Jajji was attacking Sanji through a human wall and his cape in intact. Rhavkin (talk) 16:09, July 21, 2016 (UTC)

It didn't turn black, it was just shadowed due to the light coming from the fire, like Judge's hair. It's burning in the panel where Sanji attacks and there's a burning sound effect. The flames go out when Judge spins around in the air. 16:18, July 21, 2016 (UTC)

"...It was just shadowed due to the light..."? Do You not know how shadows work? And the burning SFX was from Sanji not the cape. And where do you see the flames (that didn't exist) go out? Rhavkin (talk) 16:43, July 21, 2016 (UTC)

I don't think that's Haki. If it were then the entire cape would be black, but a lot of it is still light. The cape is black in areas that would shadow out the light from Sanji's fire, so yeah, it's shadows. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 18:14, July 21, 2016 (UTC)

Although looking at the chapter, I did notice that Jajji's glove turned black when he grabbed Sanji, even though it's normally a light color. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 21:06, July 21, 2016 (UTC)

I think that's just the heavy shadows/fire effect again. It looks like his glove is catching fire. 21:27, July 21, 2016 (UTC)

We cannot say it is Haki in chapter 833. --Klobis (talk) 00:01, July 22, 2016 (UTC)

The sfx used in the cape scene was "basa", which is just the flapping sound of his moving cape. 04:30, July 22, 2016 (UTC)

Its Haki.


 * Look at other images of Haki:, , and . Haki reflects light and you can see the person details.
 * Look at other images of Diable Jambe: and . Sanji's back is shadowed but the target is in light.
 * Look at a character that can use Haki but is shadowed . See the difference?
 * Now look at Jajji:

Rhavkin (talk) 08:11, July 22, 2016 (UTC)

My judgement from the drawing, it is not a haki. --Feroza (talk) 11:48, July 22, 2016 (UTC)

I think it's haki. On Collier Shot panel the cape is too close to the foot to be that shadowed. And if that were to be shadows, the same should happen in the panel where Jajji impales the wall. But not the wall nor anything else is shadowed. Mihawkins (talk) 15:00, July 22, 2016 (UTC)

I call Haki too, the entire gauntlet turned black when he grabbed Sanji's leg. Furthermore, it'd make sense for him to be able to grab something burning hot with haki. "Fireproof" gloves could certainly fit the bill if we gonna play the advanced technology game, but he recognized Sanji's haki.....so he's at least knowledgeable of it, if absolutely nothing else. HanataSanchou (talk) 21:31, July 22, 2016 (UTC)

It's clear that we don't have enough information to have a clear majority here. Another option is to just wait and see if we receive more to work with. 23:01, July 27, 2016 (UTC)

Appears to early to tell right now. I say we wait it out until we can be certain. 23:06, July 27, 2016 (UTC)

Here's an example of the shadow effects from Diable Jambe. Or I guess you could say Jabra and Sanji had Haki before the timeskip! 23:12, July 27, 2016 (UTC)

What Besty said 19:06, July 30, 2016 (UTC)

I think with what Besty posted, it's too speculative now. I think we need to wait until we see more in the future. Closing this discussion for now. 16:18, August 3, 2016 (UTC)

Age
One Piece Magazine Vol.3 characters note wrote he is 56 years old. How credible is it? Rhavkin (talk) 09:15, October 10, 2017 (UTC)

The age was written next to an old design sketch where he even had a different name, so I'm sure if we can take it as a canon age for the finalized Judge. 11:07, October 10, 2017 (UTC)