Head Shot vs. Face Shot
I think the face shot is better. It provides more detail and we can still see who he is. uknownada Talk 00:54, April 13, 2014 (UTC)
So much for stopping an edit war. uknownada Talk 05:06, April 18, 2014 (UTC)
What detail does the face-shot have that the head-shot doesn't?
The nose and scar in the head-shot are pretty incomplete. Plus there's a whole lot of extra space in the head-shot. uknownada Talk 17:44, April 25, 2014 (UTC)
I'm very, very torn on this. Neither are perfect portraits. The head shot is missing detail, while the face shot is poorly proportioned for a portrait. I guess it depends which aspect you believe is more important (which this community will never agree :/ ). Personally, I'm a little bit biased towards detail, so I'm leaning (very) slightly towards the face shot. SSS, The Really Cool Guy Talk 17:22, July 20, 2014 (UTC)
Anime headshot vs anime faceshot
Hate to start a pointless argument over this, but I think this one can be easily solved. Unlike the manga headshot the anime one is much more clear and all the details are there. The hair is basically the same in both anime versions but a slight difference with the top of the scar. As we've seen with Oda, he can never keep a scar perfect and in the same spot, remember Garp's moving scar counted by an SBS reader? The anime faceshot is nice, but to me seems a touch too close-up. So as you can guess, I'm for the anime headshot. AsuraDrago 03:15, January 26, 2015 (UTC)
Face shot is much more centered and still has superior detail. --Mandon (talk) 16:22, January 26, 2015 (UTC)
The detail isn't that much of a difference, the headshot is centered just fine. If you want examples of bad angles and detail look at Bartolomeo and Law's portraits. The face-shot looks so awkward. AsuraDrago 18:09, January 26, 2015 (UTC)
The problem is, the headshot is upscaled, so there's going to be a loss of quality if it's used. The face shot however doesn't need to be zoomed in because the frame itself is already zoomed to showcase his face, rather than his upper body. The point of a portrait is to show a character's face, not his head, and in that regard the current photo is far superior, since you can see his scar better while the image is downsized. Sabo's face is also thinner than it should be and his eyes are focused at a weird angle. --Mandon (talk) 19:22, January 26, 2015 (UTC)
I'd prefer an image that can include his chin. It's something we just need to have. That's all I have to say on this one. JustSomeDude... Talk | 21:20, January 26, 2015 (UTC)
Honestly, even though I made that argument previously, I can go with either version. The only thing the headshot is missing is part of his nose and scar, but it's not THAT bad. The manga versions had a much larger difference in detail, but not so much for the anime images. uknownada Talk 00:22, January 27, 2015 (UTC)
Quite, the headshot is centered just fine and the detail is there. AsuraDrago 00:24, January 27, 2015 (UTC)
I never said it wasn't adequette, I just don't think it needs to be changed when the current image is far more attractive as a portrait and isn't upscaled like the proposed. The focus should be Sabo's face, not his head, and the proposed takes focus away from his face, which is the whole point of portraits to begin with. --Mandon (talk) 03:29, January 27, 2015 (UTC)
Either version is good. That's all I have to say. Salad King I hate veggies. 13:17, January 27, 2015 (UTC)
I prefer the faceshot. The headshot looks a bit off somehow. Awaikage Talk 16:34, January 27, 2015 (UTC)
What about a more face-focused crop of the first version? Now we get the focus on his face, as well actually including all of his face. JustSomeDude... Talk | 03:36, January 28, 2015 (UTC)
With that it basically comes down to deciding against a detailed face shot without chin or an upscaled head shot with chin. I'm still for current. There's no need to change it for a less detailed photo. --Mandon (talk) 05:21, January 28, 2015 (UTC)
Yeah, I agree with Mandon. Compared to the faceshot, the headshot (cropped or not) looks off, like Sabo's face has been stretched or something. Awaikage Talk 08:16, January 28, 2015 (UTC)
I agree with Mandon and Kage, I'm going for the faceshot. It's detailed and doesn't look as awkward as Sabo's fact in the headshot, as Kage said. Jademing Talk 02:05, January 29, 2015 (UTC)
Clear majority here. Not in my favor, but still a clear majority and I'll respect that. I'd still prefer an alternate image, so watch out in the future. It would be nice to get one with the chin and with better lighting. JustSomeDude... Talk | 04:41, January 29, 2015 (UTC)
Since most others prefer the faceshot that's fine and I'll respect that. As JSD mentioned I'm sure there will be better images in future episodes. AsuraDrago 22:04, January 30, 2015 (UTC)
I'm absolutely be open to a headshot image if a better one becomes available, which it will. --Mandon (talk) 02:27, January 31, 2015 (UTC)
Hat vs. No hat
I'm for no hat. uknownada Talk 21:52, November 14, 2015 (UTC)
There's absolutely no reason to change the current image due to the obvious flaws of the proposed. It's less centred, has worse lighting and detail - and if the only benefit is showing the top of Sabo's head and scar which are pretty much always hidden to begin with because he's constantly wearing his hat, then I see no reason to change the current image - which is a perfect portrait image. That said, I'm for the current. --Mandon (talk) 23:13, November 14, 2015 (UTC)
The one with the hat is slightly more detailed and Sabo's hat is apart of his character, just like Luffy. Might as well let it stay the same. Why not put the hatless pic of him in the gallery to show off his hair? AsuraDrago 03:29, November 15, 2015 (UTC)
The infobox already shows him without his hat though. I mean we may end up finding a photo to replace it so in that event we should definitely do that. --Mandon (talk) 19:23, November 15, 2015 (UTC)
Hatless pic looks better. Awaikage Talk 21:58, November 15, 2015 (UTC)
Oh yeah I forgot to mention the proposed image is also upscaled.. so there's that too, on top of less detail, sabo looking down, less centred angle, dimmer lighting, etc etc. --Mandon (talk) 20:18, November 16, 2015 (UTC)
Now that I look at it, I guess I can go with either. uknownada Talk 21:38, November 16, 2015 (UTC)
Most important part is to show the whole scar, hat doesn't do that. We do not need the hat in a portrait, we do need all facial features though. JustSomeDude... Talk | 04:14, November 17, 2015 (UTC)
We can see his scar in the infobox, or why not put a close-up of it in the gallery? AsuraDrago 04:16, November 17, 2015 (UTC)
That hatless one is the best one. SeaTerror (talk) 07:00, November 17, 2015 (UTC)
That one is good for the scar, but it looks awkwardly close for the portrait. Plus I think he looks better with this trademark hat. In the end all of them are good pics, I'll go with whatever majority takes over. AsuraDrago 18:04, November 17, 2015 (UTC)
Ask yourself this. Is it really that important to show the whole scar at the cost of such a drop in picture quality? The proposed image is worse in every possible way [detail, color, angle, expression] to the point where it's downright insane to consider changing it for something that can easily be conveyed [and is conveyed] in the gallery & infobox images respectively. I remember a similar debate going on over the absence of Ace's freckles in his infobox picture, and everyone was in agreement that picture quality is more important than minor details. Why is this any different?
Also, if we've actually reached such a low point in our standards for infobox images, I'm 100% sure that I can find a better option than the hatless image. EDIT: Also, I should add that Sabo's hat always covers the top of his scar anyways. He's always wearing his hat with the one exception where he's still putting his clothes back on after winning his devil fruit. So in my opinion, I think including the hat should set precedence over his full scar - because wearing his hat with the scar covered is how he's most frequently seen.
SECOND EDIT: But, for the sake of weighing our options here - if we absolutely must have a photo showing his full scar and that's the consensus, then I added a better option. Sorry for the low resolution, I stopped paying for crunchyroll this month to cut costs. As you can see, it's quite similar to the image originally proposed, with the exception that it isn't upscaled, the detail is better and the expression is slightly better too. I don't think the current image needs to be changed and I'm still in favor of the original, but I think we can all agree that this image is a better version of the proposed and should replace it in the discussion. --Mandon (talk) 22:11, November 18, 2015 (UTC)
Despite the wall of text for such a minor issue, my thoughts have not changed. I now greatly prefer the hatless one, since high quality has been provided. JustSomeDude... Talk | 19:35, November 20, 2015 (UTC)
I don't think it was minor at all, given the horrendous quality of the previous version. With the HQ version, however - it's now just a matter of lighting and expression rather than quality.. so I guess it really just comes down to that. I think we should poll it, since there doesn't seem to be a clear majority either way. --Mandon (talk) 20:48, November 20, 2015 (UTC)
Current hatless version other than the one I posted earlier is the best one. SeaTerror (talk) 21:32, November 20, 2015 (UTC)
The updated hatless version does look nice, but the one with the hat looks much more refined and detailed in my opinion. Plus like I said the hat is apart of his main look like Luffy with his strawhat. AsuraDrago 21:30, November 22, 2015 (UTC)
Time for a poll. And yeah I agree completely Asura - Sabo's hat always obscures his scar so it all comes down to one or the other. Do we show his full scar or his hat? Which is more important to show? The hat has been with him since his debut, before he even got the scar.. the answer seems obvious to me. Clearly the hat is more important. --Mandon (talk) 20:09, November 23, 2015 (UTC)
I suppose a poll might be the option, but it seems silly to hold one over a hat. AsuraDrago 02:59, November 24, 2015 (UTC)
It's not just the hat.. people seem to like the other photo too and it may just be a situation of preference. Other people think the scar is more important to show than the hat, so they deserve a say too. Since there's no clear majority I think a poll would be the best option. --Mandon (talk) 18:44, November 25, 2015 (UTC)
Well I know the scar is an issue, but we can already see that just fine in the infobox. If we poll it then so be it. Lets see what the others say again just in case we don't need too. AsuraDrago 02:52, November 26, 2015 (UTC)
Image polls are very easy, no reason why you guys can't write them up yourself, just copy/paste from a recent poll. JustSomeDude... Talk | 01:53, November 30, 2015 (UTC)
Poll Discussion
Tie. What do we do here? Extend it another week or close it? --Mandon (talk) 03:14, December 8, 2015 (UTC)
Poll
 |
This was a poll regarding {{{about}}}.
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| which version of the image to use Status: Closed
| |
Original or Episode of Sabo?
While I disagree with you locking the file, Awai - because this isn't a new candidate, and has been up long enough to be considered the original.. let's go ahead and take it to talk.
Should we use the Episode of Sabo image, with the buggy eyes, less centered expression and inferior detail, or the original, which is more centered, has more symmetrical eye shape, and less saturated colours. Let me go on the record as saying that the artwork in that special is incredibly poor and we should refrain from using anything from it in the future - but that's just me. One look at the two images and it's clear which one should be used. The simple fact is that the proposed image doesn't look like Sabo. The original represents the way Oda draws him a lot better. --Mandon (talk) 16:22, August 27, 2016 (UTC)
The file page says "Note: It has been determined by discussion that we use the Episode of Sabo image as the portrait. Do not revert. Any new image candidates in the future should be brought up in a talk first.". That was not done with this new image. SeaTerror informed you of this in his reversion summary, but you continued to revert so I had to lock the file.
Anyway, as stated in the comments, the new image has worse lighting and the neck looks weird. I prefer the Episode of Sabo image. Awaikage Talk 19:55, August 27, 2016 (UTC)
Mind elaborating further? Simply dismissing something because it looks "weird" without clarifying kind of makes for a dull argument. I agree the neck is a little on the thick side, but should that REALLY be the deciding factor when it comes to a portrait? The face is what matters. As far as the thick neck goes, I think you're seeing a problem in the wrong place. The issue is that his neck is too thin in the original. If you look at any manga panel Sabo's featured in, his neck girth is more or less consistent with the proposed image. Anyways, neck aside - the lighting isn't "better" in the original, it's just more saturated and bright. The colours are more natural in the proposed, but even putting that aside - the issue still remains of Sabo's expression in the original. He's looking down, and the result makes his eyes look buggy. His smile's also awkward and wide - it just doesn't have the headstrong cockiness Sabo usually carries when he smirks, while the proposed does. --Mandon (talk) 05:23, August 29, 2016 (UTC)
The correct policy is to bring new images to the talk page, which was not done. Also, coming to my talk page to request a poll be started here is:
1) totally unneeded, as there have only been two people discussing this image, and polls should only be started when there is no clear majority.
2) incredibly lazy, as anyone is allowed to make a poll, and there is documentation and test periods which allow for polls to be easily made and edited so that the proper procedure can be followed.
But in regards to the actual image, I support the previous poll result. JustSomeDude... Talk | 17:28, September 1, 2016 (UTC)
Wasn't your whole case for using the current image in the last poll based on scar visibility? You can see it much more clearly in the current photo, especially in a thumbnail.
Anyways, I was under the impression that an admin had to start polls. I wasn't being lazy - I just didn't understand the policy.
Can someone start a poll? THis may sound noobish but I honestly don't know how. And I'm not going to just forget about this discussion (I know how much people like to ignore ongoing discussions in order to keep their images / policies that are under question as is, hoping the opposition will forget about it entirely) so we might as well start it. --Mandon (talk) 01:48, September 4, 2016 (UTC)