Do we really need this page!? MasterDeva 06:39, January 5, 2010 (UTC)
Y not? Ive kinda been wantin this page to be put up. Locke831 08:36, January 5, 2010 (UTC)
- It's a bit poorly made and not well thought out. It also borders on being too trivial.Mugiwara Franky 10:31, January 5, 2010 (UTC)
- I think we don't need separate articles for clothing of single characters. This should be described in the appearance section of a character's page. El Chupacabra 16:00, January 5, 2010 (UTC)
- I agree with Chupacabra. MasterDeva 16:39, January 5, 2010 (UTC)
- My thoughts are this; items go on the characters main page in their "description" page, why else need they a separate or page dedicated to them. If a gallery space is needed for outfits "appearance" on the characters page gallery is all we need. Otherwise, this page is a waste. One-Winged Hawk 18:25, January 5, 2010 (UTC)
But no one ever puts up pictures of all the clothes that the straw hats have worn throughout the series and maybe some people wanna see them. Locke831 18:11, January 5, 2010 (UTC)
- Please sign every comment you make with ~~~~ so that people know who they are talking to and to keep track of the conversation (I've added the time stamps on your two previous messages). Now about your last comment, if people haven't put pictures of the clothes Straw Hats have worn over the series do you honestly believe they will put them here?
- Because peoples are too lazy that doesn’t mean the page is useless. Tipota 00:38, January 6, 2010 (UTC)
- Everything regarding a character's appearance must AND should be put in their respective page! What we must avoid at all costs is page cluttered with images!! That's why a Bountie's page with the images of all the Bounties shown hasn't been made and partially one of the reasons that a page showing images of every Devil Fruit attack was rejected (even in their respective Devil Fruit page). MasterDeva 18:58, January 5, 2010 (UTC)
- I was wondering why we have templates with images? ([[Pirate guide]]) Tipota 00:38, January 6, 2010 (UTC)
- ^This. Indeed, there are sometimes unavoidable circumstances where we need more images then normal (identification templates) but otherwise images cause lag, and are usually nothing more then pretty decorations. The bounties page is the best example in fact on the matter, its not a great idea to have too many images, because working around images at times can be hard. A picture should never be more then a back up to explain in image what cannot be done in text. Image Guidelines for more info on that note. One-Winged Hawk 19:43, January 5, 2010 (UTC)
- It depends on how you use the page only for decor or to give some extra info. Also the image overloading problem can be solved using tabs. Tipota 00:38, January 6, 2010 (UTC)
I think this page is great and necessaryAzNSammanX26 21:50, January 5, 2010 (UTC)
I think you rushed a bit to answer Tipota. When I was talking about the page I meant in the same way as Mugiwara Franky being too much trivial and we don't want that. Secondly when I was talking about a page cluttered with images I had in my mind as an example a page filled pictures of every single attack Luffy has EVER made, that's what.
In the Pirate guide we are using templates with pics made for identification purposes that are used in almost very pirate crew's page that's no news. They were created for that and they were put in the Pirate's Guide page, after, they weren't created for that reason only.
Special tabs can indeed be used to solve the problem with multiple images showing on the page. I'm sure that since you support the idea you are also ready to provide the images since it's not difficult for you to do BUT all I focused on was if this page is really necessary!
Why not put the pictures in their respective character articles!? If we continue with this and since they are pics of the characters, shouldn't we attach the pics to their pages too as part of the gallery!? You can see that this raises a few questions and creates some problems. MasterDeva 01:52, January 6, 2010 (UTC)
- I just don't see the need for every costume they wear or what not needs to be here. We know who Nami is via one picture or two. I look at a gallery only page as "Not providing enough information" at all. Sure you have pretty pics, but your not telling us the pics purpose here other then purely decorative, because at the moment thats all it is. The identification pictures we have in templates came out of the original problem of this wikias early days; minor characters who aren't rushed to be named. I think of Arlong minor crew members in this. When we're dealing with 200+ characters, its a problem. See its not like we can't identify every crew member of the straw hats. And when I look at the mock-up Robin page, is it ness. to include both a coat and non-coat version of the SAME uniform all the time? I liken this to the Barbie doll scenario, where every few years they release say, another mermaid Barbie doll, only time her tail is pink instead of blue like the last time. Plus there are fansites out there who do cater for it, better then we can.
- It was not so long ago someone pointed out the German wikia had a page for this kind of thing, and thats okay, but the German site also has spoilers and their translation whereas our rules prevent it, save our spoiler forum. In other words, different wikia, different set of rules and guidelines, different sets of editors with different opinions, different purposes slightly to what they were set up for. The German wikia is pretty much intending to be a fansite wikia, and while we're also a fansite, we spawned out of the wikipedia scenario. :-/ One-Winged Hawk 08:53, January 6, 2010 (UTC)
- Most costumes are in fact shown on images illustrating the various story arc sections. The "main" or "typical" outfits should be shown in the appearance section. However, an article describing the various outfits of the Straw hats is unnecessary. It's the same as the separate pages for the attacks, they have been deleted and this page should be deleted too. El Chupacabra 11:13, January 6, 2010 (UTC)
Ok, I have written to the German Wiki and their wiki contains the toggling functions. To use it on our site, we have to add these functions in this page, but I believe only an admin can do that. To me, it is the compromise solution between the ones who want to keep the page and the one who doesn't want a page full of images. Kdom 09:37, January 9, 2010 (UTC)
- I don't think it matters, the points have been made already, that this is unness. To have either way. But lets make a note here, we have much other important work to do here like chapters and episodes. I'd only consider a page like this myself as a extra, after all the other needed pages were filled in. But as it stands, we have all those pages to complete and we don't need extras right now like this. One-Winged Hawk 11:20, January 9, 2010 (UTC)
- Well said, after everything else is completed then we can bring this back from the dead, until then it goes straight to the graveyard!! MasterDeva 11:24, January 9, 2010 (UTC)
- Honestly, beside myself (and XxJellyfishxx recently), nobody has made some real efforts in the chapter articles (beside the latest ones), so it is a bit unrealistic to think that they will be completed before a long long time. But any other editor is welcomed because I'm not sure I will do with the Skypiea saga, what I have done with the Arabasta one. I don't know much concerning the Episode but I'm not sure there is much more editor beside Tipota
- But my point was rather to emphasized that there was a technology that could be useful for the wiki on some other articles which is not available yet. Kdom 11:57, January 9, 2010 (UTC)
- Why do we need this software? The use of of pages like [[Nico Robin/Arabasta]] combined with a "close" template gives a similar effect. El Chupacabra 15:08, January 9, 2010 (UTC)
- Well I'm not denying the usefulness or uselessness of such a thing, that is irrelevant to the discussion here. The discussion taking place here is whether or not we even need these pages to begin with. That can be discussed elsewhere, and I've no objections at all to the toggle feature being introduced to the wikia. But keep on track on this page with the current discussion. I recommend on the straw hats clothing page, we just go to vote and settle it once and for all. I'll open the poll myself when I return from snapping photos of snow. One-Winged Hawk 15:23, January 9, 2010 (UTC)
- The coding is indeed something to note down. However, it kinda is really a different matter to this article.Mugiwara Franky 06:50, January 11, 2010 (UTC)
Votes for "Straw Hat Clothing"
This covers the need to list all the straw hat clothing, as well as the page, might as well get all the issues linked to this over and done with in one go.
To be closed on: 16th Jan 2010
Note: If we all agree "for" it, a proper design discussion on how we will achieve this can be started to save bickering. Also I don't think its one of those discussions that is permanently closed. In the future there *may* be a need to reopen it, but for now lets decide if we need it NOW. One-Winged Hawk 16:33, January 9, 2010 (UTC)
List of Arguments, notes and points
- Why do we need to list ever single version of the SHs clothing when only a few pics will help identify them?
- Does this classify as "decoration" or "demonstration"? The latter is fine by Image Guidelines rules by decoration is not.
- We have "appearance"on a characters page for the most major of the clothing they have worn.
- Is there a call for it? I.e. can the wikia continue just fine without it?
- New coding is needed (not a problem for the most part, but thats a different discussion)
- German wikia already has this so why can't we?
- We're not the German wikia and our overall functions are different.
- Against: I see no need at all for it. One-Winged Hawk
- Against: Same as Emfrbl we don't need this page now. MasterDeva 17:02, January 9, 2010 (UTC)
- Against: Just gonna say there are already galleries in the Appearance sections.Mugiwara Franky 06:50, January 11, 2010 (UTC)
- Against: We don't ned this page, but many galleries in appearance sections can be improved. El Chupacabra 10:08, January 11, 2010 (UTC)
- Agree: Finally it was created, my reason is we can add their valuable items here, Luffy: hat, Zoro:bandana, stomacheband, Nami:bracelet, Usopp: googles, Sanji:Shoes, Chopper: hat(he's hat wasn't seen on MiniEastBlueSaga), Franky: pants, Brook:hat and necktie maybe
- Psst Coldhandz you forgot to sign with ~~~~. One-Winged Hawk 11:37, January 11, 2010 (UTC)
- Neutral: I don't think it is very usefull, but if some people are ready to make it, why stop them ? Kdom 22:47, January 11, 2010 (UTC)