Talk: One Piece Film: Strong World

Status

Wouldn't Shiki be an admiral? You know, color + animal = admiral.

He is a pirate, its confirmed. One-Winged Hawk 10:37, December 9, 2009 (UTC)

could anyone!!!

please anyone help me in updating picture and information int his page.Rainelz 11:26, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

is this a cannon

is this a cannon and if this is a cannon and would be after the whitebeard saga then there would be less than 20 manga chapter left before straw hat meets.Rainelz 11:49, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

Based on the antagonist's name being the same name of the prisoner who escaped Impel Down, and the flying islands and flying island ship which fit with the prisoner's nickname, its apparently canon. Where in the manga it fits however is the question. It could be before the Straw Hats arrived at Sabaody or after they would rejoin in the future. In any case, the movie being canon is the only definite answer at the moment.Mugiwara Franky 12:25, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

Above is total bullshit. There is nothing to suggest this movie is canon. Kinjishi appears in both, that means nothing as we've seen canon characters used in filler stories before. There is no precedence of anything animated being canon in relation to the comic book.

1. Watch the language
2. Oda's confirmed long since AUGUST THE 10TH that its CANON... Or suppose to be canon. But we lack more details to fine tune things and sort it out. Oda's writing this one himself to fit the storyline. Finger crossed he gives US enough to work with.
3. Don't forget to sign your posts with ~~~~One-Winged Hawk 18:21, November 27, 2009 (UTC)

I shortened the ever growing speculative/incorrect trivia about if/when/maybe on it being canon. Its canon, the first movie intending to be canon that is, so lets leave it at that. Chapter 0 is Oda's work, the movies written by him, heck if Oda could do animation I have do doubt every cell would be his too this time round. One-Winged Hawk 00:34, November 29, 2009 (UTC)

Show me one quote from Oda stating it to be canon and I will concede. Until then, shut the fuck up jackass.

1. Don't use bad language, you've been noted on it and next time you'll get strikes against you.
2. Sign you damn posts with ~~~~!
3. Shiki was mentioned in the Impel Down arc.
4. SBS, Oda confirmed there was a tie in.
5. Chapter 0.
6. The movie has been stated by Oda already that it is him writing and intending for it to be canon.

Everyone should KNOW this by now. If you want quotes, look up Arlong Park Forums, they've been floating around for a year and I don't have time to track everything down. For now, you've got to live with the list above until someone finds it for you. Plus I'm actually INCLINED to help the ultra rude. >:-( One-Winged Hawk 14:24, December 8, 2009 (UTC)

No, that is pure supposition on your part.

1/ Shiki was mentioned in Impel Down, that confirms Shiki as a canon character. It does not confirm Strong World is canon.

2/ One Piece chapter 0 is canon, One Piece volume 0 is canon, that does not mean the movie is canon any more than that crappy Apis Dragon arc or Ice Hunter, which, by the way, was also based off a scenario by Oda and characters designed by him.

3/ Oh no internet nannying what will I ever do

4/ Where is this SBS quote? You mention it yet don't provide it or link to it.

5/ Where are these quotes from Oda on Arlong Park forums? I've been a regular poster there since 2004 and there is the exact same theorising trying to pass as fact as you are doing here. No quotes.

Huh will you look at that

6/ Where is this quote from Oda stating that he intends the movie to be canon. Which of your orifices was this expelled from?

You keep talking about these quotes yet can't back it up for shit.

Love,

~~~~

You got the signing wrong. Without the "nowiki" coding please.

1. Okay so you want to dismiss everything Oda's done in the last year. Good for you.
2. Chapter 0 is the prequel to the movie, hence why you get it for free when you go to see the movie.
3. Not internet nanny, more like demand for respect, if you want us to talk to you respectfully its a two way thing and you've got to talk to us in proper manners. Don't cry when we ban you, because I think I speak for everyone here when I say its better to have a uncooperative but a pleasant editor then a loud mouth trash talker who likes to insult people more then he or she cares to be reasonable. Get it now? This is the net, you can get away with that language elsewhere but if you step the line, folks don't think twice about banning you. We're giving you 3 strikes, thats more then some on the net would. Don't push your luck.
4. There are 56 vols. and you can find most on Arlong Park forums website. I just don't have time to go through the sites SBS, but since your not a reglaur editor unlike me, you have PLENTY of time. Use it rather then waste ours.
5. I'm not doubting your a Arlong Poster, but I'm also not doubting if you haven't seen them you've therefore aren't paying attention to all the details. Not quotes per such, but interviews, SBS notes, everything you can IMAGINE gets on there, most of it comes and goes within a week. If you don't pay attention, you miss it.
6. Right back in the early days of Oda talking about the movie. Its a VERY long time ago, almost a year, and as I say constantly on this wikia I don't have a lot of time for the wikia right now.

I can back it up if I have time, to flick through all the sources that SHOULD have been on the page when they were released BUT didn't beause of a number of reasons takes time. I set a whole morning the other day for the Giants page alone. I had to go through other 30 chapters with a fine comb looking for references, because they weren't there to begin with. But then again, your attitude tells me a lot about you since you can't be bothered to look it up yourself and see what you've missed. If I have a day at the weekend I'll damn well do it, if I don't it will have to wait until I can. Editors are people and people have LIVES to live believe it or not and we're not here to serve the every bidding of some random IP address who won't do the work themselves. If you really are content with being right, then pull up info to prove I'm wrong.

But for now, settle on this: Oda wrote Chapter 0, Oda's written the movie, Chapter 0 is the prequel to the movie. >_< One-Winged Hawk 19:55, December 8, 2009 (UTC)

So what if Oda wrote Chapter 0 and movie 10?

Isn’t it odd to say that movie 10 is canon when Oda for his personal reasons remove this part of the story from the canon storyline? SBS Volume 55 page 126 and page 192 this is the ONLY (confirmed) information from Oda about the movie 10 and Kinjishi. Tipota 20:44, December 8, 2009 (UTC)

The SBS is simply stating at the time of the manga WB and Shanks meeting, Oda didn't want to mention it as it was too much information, but later he got to introduce it anyway by via the movie. All thats happened is something similar to what happened with Logue town arc fillers, only out of them, only Daddy Masterson is an Oda intended story. One-Winged Hawk 21:49, December 8, 2009 (UTC)

Also, this movie has supposedly been 2 years almost in the making and that takes us way back to the late Thriller Bark arc, though if you believe things also Oda threw one script out as well on top of it. How true both these are I can't say, since its second hand words spoken here. We've gone through SA arc, Amazon Lily and Impel Down in the process. One-Winged Hawk 21:58, December 8, 2009 (UTC)

Er what? I've sworn a lot on this site and nobody has ever said anything to me. Chapter 0 is canon at least. We will have to see how the movie fits into the storyline though. If at all. Drunk Samurai 01:49, December 9, 2009 (UTC)

Okay, based on the edits of the anon, it's just bad faith and semi-vandalism.

For the movie, there are several points to support it being canon.

1. Oda is the writer
2. Shiki is mentioned in the manga as being the first person to escape Impel Down
3. Oda confirmed that Shiki of the movie is the one and the same with the prisoner
4. Chapter 0 shows Shiki
5. Indigo is also shown in Chapter 0
6. Indigo's creations are also found in Chapter 0

The movie's pretty much canon based on these and others. For Oda not using the scenario in his manga proper, it appears that he wants to present this part of One Piece via a movie. It's not the first time a story teller or any creator has decided to present their creation in another medium.Mugiwara Franky 06:39, December 9, 2009 (UTC)

Full Metal Alchemist comes to mind off the top of my head for some reason in regards to that. One-Winged Hawk 08:42, December 9, 2009 (UTC)

That's probably because the Full-Metal Alchemist movie "Conqueror of Shamballa" is considered canon as it acts as the extended conclusion of the first anime series.

Kaizoku-Hime 09:09, December 9, 2009 (UTC)

The first FMA anime series is kinda uncanon to its manga. After a few manga related scenarios, the anime started doing things completely different from the manga. The biggest change would be the bad guy and some of the homunculi. The movie Conqueror of Shamballa is indeed an extension of the first anime series, however its pretty much uncanon to the manga. Both the first FMA anime series and the movie are uncanon as they include major stuff that aren't part of the manga.

For Strong World on the hand, it has alot of stuff that connects it the manga. Its most prominent support for it being canon is Oda who is even making alot of stuff in the manga itself that ties with the movie.Mugiwara Franky 09:30, December 9, 2009 (UTC)

I couldn't remember too much about FMA, its been a long time since I saw it. Hence why I said "for some strange reason". Anyway, when we place this movie. I'm guessing before SA arc as Brook's in it, and no one else from current storyline. One-Winged Hawk 10:34, December 9, 2009 (UTC)

I want to throw something into the discussion here as to this movie and whether it's canon or not, and I don't think it's wholly "canon" in the traditional sense of the word, mostly for one reason. In this movie, Luffy doesn't wear the armband he picked up at the end of the Thriller Bark arc.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LFwAAX9njE

Pause that video at around 0:27. Both of Luffy's arms are clearly visible, and neither of them is sporting that armband. Luffy always wore this armband through the entirety of the Sabaody Archipelago and Amazon Lily arcs. He never even took it off until he gave it to Buggy around the beginning of the Impel Down arc. Also, considering that Oda himself was in charge of things, I doubt he would've allowed such a grievous error to slip through unnoticed.

Even given the above, though, I don't think we can simply write the entire movie off as filler and be done with it. As stated plenty of times above, there is a lot of evidence supporting its canonity. Therefore, I propose that Strong World is just as canon as movie 9, Episode of Chopper+. With the case of movie 9, a past arc was modified to add in future content. So with Strong World, we have a future arc modified to add in past content. Or at least to make up for stuff that hasn't happened yet. I think it's likely that the manga will eventually go through a Shiki arc which we be similar to, though still very different from, movie 10. SavageLarxene011 05:04, May 9, 2010 (UTC)

For the armband thing, it's kinda just an accessory. It not being on Luffy's arm doesn't necessarily suggest that he already gave it to Buggy and the events of Strong World are a future arc. The theory it may happen in the manga in the future may still happen I guess, but it's still a theory of sorts.Mugiwara Franky 23:43, May 9, 2010 (UTC)

Also, in the end of Chapter 0, it says that 20 years are already passed, so this is the link to Strong World.. In other words, if Chapter 0 is canon (and it is), then Strong World is canon per se. And the 1st reference don't proof anything (only that One Piece manga is finishing its first half).

So I think that we must change from this: "and is believed by many to be canonical, yet this is not confirmed" to this: "is the only movie be canonical. Dragon_NJMB 14:46, November 15, 2010 (UTC)

You can blame Greg at Arlong Park... Guy caused more hassle for the wikia then he was worth and led a campagine against us without the Arlong Park forum staff picking up on it until I pointed it out. He even came on here and vandalised our pages to insult us and dance around like an idiot on the issue as well. We had to word it as it is stop the oppotunity being there for him to do it again.

There are also other things to mention on this, but some things that happened at the time had to be done quietly behind closed doors, basically because it involes a few members of the AP forums staff. I think he got banned by MF, so if you want to do it, you can reword it again. One-Winged Hawk 22:24, November 15, 2010 (UTC)

So is ok if I change from "and is believed by many to be canonical, yet this is not confirmed" to this: "is the only movie be canonical? Dragon_NJMB 15:10, November 17, 2010 (UTC)

why do people misread quotes, oda only says that this is the last adventure for luffy as a seventeen year old, that doesn't mean it's canon. Canon needs to fit perfectly wihtin the storyline. the tenth movie doesn't, hoever episode 0 manga and anime does. The movie has brook in it, meaning it if it was canon it should have happened between leaving thriller bark and arriving at sabaody, Yet it didn't it wasn't in the manga and it doesn't connect in the anime. Remember Zoro was still very weak and injured at sabaody (thanks to oars and kuma) however in the movie he wasn't he was perfectly fine, kicking ass. There is nothing in the movie to suggest that thriller bark has happened, the only thing from thriller bark in the movie is brook. To sum things up Episode 0= Canon

Movie 10= Non Canon

(OnePieceNation 14:48, February 7, 2012 (UTC))

The entire quote is "And as far as something that will hold true for both the manga and the anime, this will be Luffy's last adventure as a 17 year-old." The "as far as something that will hold true for both the manga and the anime" bit is stating that this "adventure" does in fact hold true for both the manga and the anime. If something is true for both the manga and anime, that something is canon for both the manga and anime. As a result Strong World is canon for both the manga and anime. Bastian964 19:59, February 7, 2012 (UTC)

Actually, this could be simply read as there being no more manga adventures for Luffy as a seventeen year old, as well as there being no more movie/anime adventures with Luffy as a seventeen year old. It doesn't necessarily mean that Strong World is canon.

108.173.184.219 07:31, February 13, 2014 (UTC)

Add trivia

i think we could add that in this movie zoro will be using a gun as seen in his artwork and the possibility if this movie shows after the whitbeard war is high because luffy doesn't know any background of impel down in which the main antigonist have a relationRainelz 10:28, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

Possibly, but WB is featured and as of yet we don't know WBs fate. If thats the case, then this is placed after Thriller Bark and before the SA arc. One-Winged Hawk 14:28, December 8, 2009 (UTC)

franky

this must be the first time franky wore sensible clothes in the history of one piece

In one colour walk the entire crew was in suits I believe. One-Winged Hawk 21:43, October 9, 2009 (UTC)

Kinjishi has a Devil Fruit

Is that true or is it fake information. I don't know since I am not that up to date with the movie.

watch this video in youtube they have many information [1]Rainelz 00:19, October 18, 2009 (UTC)

find a spoiler of the movie

(this is a spoiler i found please remodel it and put in the article and thanks to Greg of AP)

<removed by One-Winged Hawk 11:24, December 13, 2009 (UTC)>

Rainelz 04:17, December 13, 2009 (UTC)

Umm, couldn't you just have provided a link instead of writing everything down.Mugiwara Franky 04:39, December 13, 2009 (UTC)

Ack! No you didn't post that! I just spoke with Greg recently about the wikia just taking his stuff. Okay, as far I'm concerned, we can reference his work, but we mustn't copy it exactly. Its opening a door with him I don't want to see open. Plus recently I've tried ensuring him we would do many things to stop his stuff being stolen directly and put onto the wikia when it does. So lets not go from copying his site to copying his forum posts please. Okay I doubt you knew what was happening everyone, but... Yeah... In the shortest form; lets not copy Greg's stuff word for word. And yes, MF is right, a link would have surpassed. ^_^' One-Winged Hawk 11:24, December 13, 2009 (UTC)

sorry about the posting it's my fault didn't read the rules first i promise it will never happen again.Rainelz 10:28, December 14, 2009 (UTC)

Last Adventure

How true is the rumor that Oda has said this is written to be Luffy's last adventure as a 17 year old? One-Winged Hawk 11:47, December 22, 2009 (UTC)

Where did he say this? Many years ago he wrote in the SBS that Luffy will always stay 17, and since he also said that he already has figured out how OP will end, it is qute unlikely that the he has changed his intentions. It is more probable that it is the last adventure of the 17-years old Luffy, the ultimate story arc/saga, and One Piece will come to an end soon. However, I think it is just another fan rumour like the "1000 chapters" rumour. El Chupacabra 15:29, December 22, 2009 (UTC)

Definately Canon? Just vote already folks!

Okay so I have Greg (of all people) now also arguing over this. Turns out our little vandal who recently vandalize the wikia to write this is either in league with Greg or Greg or something... (So instead of discussing it with us they vandalized a page???). I'm going to call a vote on canon or not because I'm tired of haressments and insults from AP forums recently over the wikia.

I'm not the God of the wikia! Dammit I'm tired of them. Lets have a VOTE now to accept this as canon and not.

Votes:

Neutral: I'm sick of AP forums and excuse for being neutral, but I no longer care if this is or isn't canon offially from this day due to Greg. One-Winged Hawk 12:31, December 22, 2009 (UTC)

Canon: I consider it canon because it was somehow integrated in the storyline and does not contradict it. El Chupacabra 15:29, December 22, 2009 (UTC)

Canon: There have many points stated here and there of why it is canon. P.S. can you show a link or something to Greg's claim about this movie being non-canon.Mugiwara Franky 15:49, December 22, 2009 (UTC)

Not without breaking the golden rule of PMs... You on AP? If not I'll have to e-mail the copy of the PM instead of forwarding it. One-Winged Hawk 07:36, December 24, 2009 (UTC)

Nope, I kinda like to visit there and other sites like it as an onlooker. My email address is _{<address removed by original poster>}. Before sending it though, is the message explicit as in whiny kid bratty explicit or worse as in DS explicit?Mugiwara Franky 10:28, December 24, 2009 (UTC)

Neither, lets get something clear, its not in the way rude, its just someone pointing a finger and going "haha, you've got it wrong!". Its just childish. ^_- One-Winged Hawk 10:39, December 24, 2009 (UTC)

Do it please. El Chupacabra 15:51, December 22, 2009 (UTC)

Canon: For the same reasons El Chupacabra stated. I'll make a list about it later that will back this up. MasterDeva 02:21, December 24, 2009 (UTC)

Neutral: I found it weird to make a movie canon, especially since it is hard to put him in the manga story line. Well I have not seen the movie, but I guess Luffy defeats Shiki in the end. And if that happens it would take much place in the manga that just an evocation of Shiki by Sengoku. I think it is an UOPO (unidentified One Piece object) which will be hard to categorize. However, I'm in favor of puting the 4 pre-strong world filler episodes in the non canon category. Honnestly, they are far from good, and unless if there is some reference to these episodes in the Movie, I consider them as 100% filler Kdom 11:14, December 24, 2009 (UTC)

Note

There I've fixed it to say it is written to be like canon. Now Greg's biased war against us is incorrect, we're not saying its canon anymore.

Take THAT Gregm its not saying it is anymore (and yet still hinting at it, either way, Greg's campaign has lost its reason to exist and we've still "won" the argument). >:-D One-Winged Hawk 01:32, December 25, 2009 (UTC)

But in our voting the majority is for acknowlediging it as canon. Greg isn't the supreme authority and not even a user on this wikia, and i don't think that we should care about his opinion. If anyone thinks that it's not canon, he should present his arguments here. P.S. When will the voting end?El Chupacabra 15:40, December 28, 2009 (UTC)

About Greg

What will it take for Greg to stop vandalizing this page!? I mean enough is enough!! MasterDeva 02:05, December 24, 2009 (UTC)

I might be wrong of accusing Greg for this but these guys from Japan that keep messing with the canon trivia must be stopped! I propose to semi-protect this page until this is over!! MasterDeva 02:11, December 24, 2009 (UTC)

You sure their from Japan? I can check the IP addresses if you want. Either way, I'll agree at least stop random IPs editing if anything. That will force them to make an account to edit and if they do that, we're not so keen on editors who sign up JUST to vandalize. ^_- One-Winged Hawk 07:38, December 24, 2009 (UTC)

Just a little note, I checked the IP addresses, MD's right, Japan. Not all the same location though.

Wasn't it Greg who paraded around the AP forums that he switched "Oz" to "Oars" back when the spoilers that linked his proper name came out? I know thats something he hasn't let me forget we had going on at AP. It was like watching a child who just proved the Earth was round and not flat like the adults were saying. ^_- One-Winged Hawk 07:49, December 24, 2009 (UTC)

From what I remember before the name Oars came up, Greg was one of those who promoted Odz over Oz. When it was revealed to be Oars, it was apparently somebody else. I must say though this matter seems to be a bit rather immature.Mugiwara Franky 10:31, December 24, 2009 (UTC)

Thats the oddest thing I even pointed out this to him via PM... I had him snap at me when I used Oz at AP and explained why because I wasn't even sure which version was correct. nd the moment Oars came out, I switched anyway. So what was his problem? He was as wrong as WE were! ^_- One-Winged Hawk 12:24, December 24, 2009 (UTC)

I think he's upset since we used Oz for a long time. According to him and other promoters of Odz prior to the revelation of Oars, was that Odz seemed more appropriate than Oz. The Japanese used for the name was definitely hard to put in English, however according to them despite it being hard, it couldn't have been Oz in anyway due to it being different from what Oz (as in Wizard of Oz) is normally written in Japanese. So they supported Odz since it seemed more appropriate to the name despite it being weird. Personally, considering that both Oz and Odz were kinda problematic, we probably should have used Óðr in the past as the giant actually shares the exact same Japanese words of a Norse God.Mugiwara Franky 12:45, December 24, 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, Odz was a awkward translation back to Japanese, I said to them at AP when I supported using Oz, Odz isn't correct either so I'll use the one I'm most familair with until I get the right correction. And I even said I know its wrong, but I got scolded for being ignorant at the time and even now. I acknowledge it was wrong and that there wasn't an alternative that was correct... So no one else got it right it didn't matter in the end. We even EXPLAINED on the page what the name problem was, what more do they want? Thats more then most other sites bothered to do in the end. They choose one or the other and never explained the name problem.

We're English speakers, we need a Latin based name to communicate successfully with other English fans. If we write Japanese text, their not even going to understand us. The problems the same with Enel and Eneru and you've seen the joke I sent you about THAT particular argument MF. ^_- One-Winged Hawk 16:17, December 24, 2009 (UTC)

Synopsis

So uhh when is one gonna be added? -Electric Turahk (Talk) 16:51, January 30, 2010 (UTC)

Once someone watched the movie or read a credible summary on the net and feels able to write it in his own words. ;) -- [ defchris ] · [ Diskussion ] ·  · 01:34, February 1, 2010 (UTC)

Joke answer: We're all lazy bastards aren't we really lol. XD

Serious answer: I don't even think its on youtube yet. It maybe too "new" to find yet anywhere. I don't even think there is a DVD release yet. It needs some time. One-Winged Hawk 11:51, February 1, 2010 (UTC)

guyz the raw is out i he net and can someone make a sypnosis now!!! i think indigo has some kind of special power here is the site:

http://www.watch-onepiece.com/watch/537-One_Piece_Movie_10_Strong_World_English_Subbed/

Sweet jesus, when is someone around here gonna write the entire true blue summary of this movie huh? The official members of this wiki surely must have seen the whole movie by now.213.89.28.95 18:11, July 9, 2010 (UTC)

Please just wait, when somebody has something then they'll write it done. You can't expect people to have everything right away.Mugiwara Franky 02:30, July 10, 2010 (UTC)

Moreover could someone just remove that full summary part? Even if the movie goes like that, I doubt you could call it a full sumary with only a few lines of text...78.20.187.74 03:29, July 12, 2010 (UTC)

Subbed yet?

Is Vegapunk or any other fansub site going to sub this movie?--Lordxehanort 22:14, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

They probably will once the DVD is out in Japan. (August 27) YazzyDream 22:22, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

Little East Blue arc

I suggest to create a separate page for Little East Blue arc (and to leave here only a brief synopsis of it and link to the main page here). Reasons:

1. This page is long enough.
2. Every other arc has a separate page.

Ruxax 18:13, August 20, 2010 (UTC)

Furthermore, the Little East Blue is not considered part of canon (no one I know of considers it canonical), whereas Oda considers Strong World part of the manga timeline (see the reference I just added to the page). Bastian964 18:53, August 20, 2010 (UTC)

Dubb Possibility?

I've heard numerous rumors flying around about a possible Funimation dubb of this movie, has there been any official news of this?

Triple Dice 19:04, August 5, 2011 (UTC)Triple Dice

no, theres no official announcement that funimation will be dubbing this. If there was it would probally be on the wiki ☠ D S P ☠ ^Yo! 21:16, June 25, 2012 (UTC)

Trivia Section Gun Use

In the trivia section about gun usage where it says "The Straw Hats are seen using guns for the first time in a story that is canonical, except for Sanji who used a gun early on in One Piece". Does this refer to his use of a gun when Robin/Ms. All Sunday first appeared on their ship? Also, Nami was shown using guns while guarding the case of money in Water Seven, while the others were destroying the Franky House (Chapter 329,330). Although in both cases, no guns were fired. And what of Franky's guns (although I guess they are technically part of his body) and Luffy's use of a gun when he accepted the Davy Back Fight (Chapter 306)? Perhaps it should be changed to "The Straw Hats are seen using guns in battle for the first time in a story that is canonical, excluding Franky's built-in firearms." I just thought if Sanji's gun use was worth mentioning the others' gun uses are too.

18.189.30.102 03:02, October 10, 2012 (UTC)

Yeah, you're right about that. I added "in battle" to the trivia, but about Franky's built in guns.... Well, I have no idea. So I'll let you convince me if you want it, or someone can add it if they really think so.  Jademing  Talk   03:08, October 10, 2012 (UTC)

I agree about leaving out the part about Franky's internal weaponry. But I think that since there are other cases in which the Strawhats used guns, the bit about Sanji should be removed since he never fired it. However, Franky/Cutty Flam did use a gun in battle against Spandam (as a club) and later a large gun/bazooka while standing on the sea train's tracks (Chapter 357). 18.189.30.102 04:41, October 10, 2012 (UTC)

Recent Challeges to Canon Status

I know that several people have been challenging the canon status of this movie elsewhere on the wiki. However, I think that needs to be done here, on this talk page rather than chat or in passing on other talk pages before it can be changed in articles and around the wiki. It should be so easy to undo the vote above on this issue. It at least needs to be discussed, and discussed here. JustSomeDude...  Talk | 19:19, December 15, 2012 (UTC)

Can someone link me to the discussion? I hope it wasn't just something decided in chat, because that's not how you make a community decision. Chat is not linkable and doesn't have a history, so it cannot be a reference for other users. leviathan_89 20:06, 15 December, 2012 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure it is canon, and we should treat it that way. Oda sort of treats it like part of the story, and so does the fanbase. Plus of course the fact that Oda served as writer and executive producer for this film, and wrote a special chapter for it. As for Zoro's condition, which conflicts how he should be in this part of the story, we really shouldn't act like plot holes don't exist in the manga either. For one thing, Devil Fruit users shouldn't move when in water. Yet in many chapters, specifically the first one, Luffy was waving his arms about and was keeping afloat. He was swimming. And that's not the only plot hole, so I don't believe we should uncanon this film just because of Zoro's condition. uknownada ^Talk 20:11, December 15, 2012 (UTC)

As the recent discussion about movie 12 demonstrate, Oda being the movie's story writer is not much an evidence for its canon status, but I agree with you Zoro's condition can be dismissed as "Indigo wasn't much of a challenge to him", in fact on Sabaody only after an exhausting battle with a Pacifista his condition was shown. The only plothole at this point should be "Brook first fight". I did not understood your example about the devil fruit users. leviathan_89 20:24, 15 December, 2012 (UTC)

Oh, it was just something how the DF users shouldn't have the strength when they're in the water than they actually do, but it's not too important. uknownada ^Talk 20:31, December 15, 2012 (UTC)

"Oda sort of treats it". You lost me there nada. Plot holes matter either way, and your devil fruit power thing makes no sense. He wasn't swimming, he nearly drowned. Devil fruit users can move in the water, but they are extremely weak and are uncapable of bringing themselves back up.

As for SW being canon. Just no.   Galaxy 9000   20:47, December 15, 2012 (UTC)

Can you link the discussion please? leviathan_89 20:51, 15 December, 2012 (UTC)

Sorry Levi, but yes it was in the chat.   Galaxy 9000   20:52, December 15, 2012 (UTC)

Also an extra detail regarding chat. If we used an irc script, we could have history.   Galaxy 9000   20:53, December 15, 2012 (UTC)

I agree with Levi on this one the only real plot hole is brooks first fight, and indigo not being a chalenge makes sense since zoro only started to show the pain from the injury from kuma when he got exhausted fighting the Pacifista so yeah it can be canon since we have more substancial proof that it is canon.also having plot holes doenst make it filler wether you like it or not. User:X-RAPTOR 20:54, December 15, 2012 (UTC)

I've told you time and time again X that non-canon =/= filler. Anyways, there are still more major plotholes. For example, why is it never referenced during the War at Marineford? Why does Sengoku not mention Luffy's exploit with Shiki when he's listing off the other stuff he's done? Why doesn't Sengoku mention Shiki being beat when he mentions he has broken out of prison? There are plenty more, but hopefully these prove my point.   Galaxy 9000   20:59, December 15, 2012 (UTC)

(edit conflic) I'm sorry guys, but you cannot make such big decisions in chat, or rather you can but before starting to changing the wiki you should write down your reasons in a talk page or in a forum to see if anyone else has something to say. Galaxy, it's not a matter of history itself, but more like having the discussion history available in the wiki without relying on external sources. If you make this kind of decision in chat, how new users are supposed to be informed? Or the users who weren't present? For example I don't know why it was decided that Strong World is not canon... I just somewhat understood that it was because those two plotholes, but as I said there is only just one plothole, which is pretty ridiculous in my opinion. If you consider Strong World not canon for that plothole then Z is surely a not canon character as well. leviathan_89 21:05, 15 December, 2012 (UTC)

I actually never said Z couldn't be canon. It really does depend on the placement of it (after or before PH). It goes either way there, but for Strong World, my thesis is that the characters are the only canon part, which works.   Galaxy 9000   21:10, December 15, 2012 (UTC)

Did you just actually decided all of that by yourself? Because it's pretty much sound like that, and since it was a chat decision I don't know how it was made :P Okay I don't know if I have the time to start analysis all of this, but "your thesis" sounds pretty much like a blog theory, so I'm pretty amazed we changed all of this just for your theory. I'll think about it later. By the way, a "plot hole" is a contradiction in the storyline, what you have just listed are not plot holes, the only one is Brook first fight. leviathan_89 21:18, 15 December, 2012 (UTC)

No. I did not decide this. This is just something that was discussed in chat by at least 10 people. Also, those things pretty much are contradictions.   Galaxy 9000   21:20, December 15, 2012 (UTC)

No matter what the plot holes are, I have yet to see something that discounts the statement Oda made of "And as far as something that will hold true for both the comic and the anime, this will be Luffy's last adventure as a 17 year-old."

I'm paying specific attention to the "something that will hold true for both the comic and the anime" part. That seems to be as close to a statement about canonicity as I've ever heard. JustSomeDude...  Talk | 02:21, December 16, 2012 (UTC)

This statement has been discussed a lot. I still fail to see how it is related to canonicity… Oda was saying that in both the current storylines at the time, Marineford and SW, Luffy was living his last adventure as a 17-year-old. Last adventure in the manga, and last adventure in the movies.
If I'm guessing correctly, you seem to think he was saying that SW is the last adventure of 17-year-old Luffy, and that this holds for the manga too. First, it would be a weird way to say something as simple as "SW is canon". Second, it means Luffy turned 18 between SW and Sabaody… Duh! How is that even remotely interesting? It isn't mentioned anywhere!
It is clear to me that he was foreshadowing the timeskip—and thus that his sentence is to be interpreted as I did above, hence not implying anything about canonicity. sff9 _{12:34, December 16, 2012}

To me that statement* is enough to prove that strong world is conan.

( * --> "something that will hold true for both the comic and the anime" ) Jaimini•626•Talk ✩ http://i1175.photobucket.com/albums/r631/jaimini626/WatchOnePieceEpisode531EnglishSubbed-WatchOP1.png

No, sff9 is right (plus I wouldn't really literally trust the translation), but I think we may have missed other Oda's comments on the matter. Anyway, there are still other strong elements that support SW being canon, but most important I fail to see real disproves of it. Especially if we take in account the recent Zephyr discussion, I think we are using two different metres of judgement. I'll try to sum them up later, but meanwhile it doesn't hurt reading again the canon-status discussion in this very same talk page, up above. leviathan_89 13:33, 16 December, 2012 (UTC)

So....canon or not? It sounds like everyone thinks this is canon right now. _••PX15.._•• 14:23, December 18, 2012 (UTC)

People fail to take into account that strong world written was during the same time marineford was written. that is why the plotholes exist. Shiki's defeat wasn't referenced in marineford in the manga because you can't just reference something in the anime to the manga, and the people who only read the manga would be confused. Some say that Shiki is canon, but SW isn't. It is canon because chapter 0 is canon, and Shiki states that he will set his plan in motion in 20 years. As for Z, there are no references in the manga or confirmation from Oda to suggest that it is.DuelMaster93 (talk) 16:27, December 18, 2012 (UTC)

Personally, I'd say non-canon; but opinions don't really matter… We have no confirmation whatsoever and there are problems with the plot, so we should not be assertive. Clearly it has a special status as compared with the first 9 movies and anime filler, but we cannot simply label it as canon. sff9 _{16:30, December 18, 2012}

Yeah. With the new "Filler History Sections" it really won't matter.

Duelmaster: Shiki is still waiting to set his plan into motion as far as we know.   Galaxy 9000   16:34, December 18, 2012 (UTC)

Galaxy9000: It has already been 20 years. If strong world isn't canon, chapter 0 isn't. In the Impel Down arc, Sengoku says that Shiki is the only successful pirate to escape impel down, proving that chapter 0 is canon. If SW isn't canon, what on earth would Shiki be doing. He doesn't look too old & he is certainly too strong to have been killed, and if he had everyone would know about it. Why did no one mention Shiki's defeat? I don't recall anyone mentioning moriah's defeat either. The news at the time was about luffy breaking in & out of impel down, so no one really cared about Shiki's defeat, considering he is a pirate the marines wouldn't of cared anyway. It may have been put on his bounty.

Reasons why Strong World is canon:

1. Oda wrote it

2. Oda stated it was canon

3. Chapter 0 is canon, therefore Shiki stating he will set his plan in motion in 20 years is also canon.

4. If Shiki is a canon character wouldn't it mean that his plans are also canon? If he died everyone would know about it.

Unless there is an encounter with Shiki in the future, or anything on what he did after he escaped impel down, it is canon DuelMaster93 (talk) 10:06, December 19, 2012 (UTC)

"2. Oda stated it was canon" This is the sole of your four points that would warrant a canon status, no discussion needed… Unfortunately this point is not true. sff9 _{10:53, December 19, 2012}

As I said for Zephyr, I think saying that Shiki/Zephyr is canon, but not the movie is a bit contradictory, it's either both or none of them. Otherwise we would the ones making fanfiction, saying something like "Shiki is still waiting out there". He is not. If you don't recognize Strong World as canon then also remove Shiki from the canon characters. leviathan_89 12:49, 19 December, 2012 (UTC)

I agree with Leviathan. He explained it better than me, but the point is Shiki can't be canon if SW isn't. What do you want to believe: - That Shiki is still waiting out there (a opinion by fans) - Or that, Strong World did happen (written by Oda) The plot holes aren't that major. There are reasons why they exist. SW was written during marineford, so of course there going to be plot holes wherever he put it. I'm sure Oda includes this apart of his story, and so should the fans. And if Shiki, was still out there waiting, what on earth would he be doing? As for Z, we need to wait a while to see where if can fit in the timeline. So far there are no connections to the manga or anything from oda to suggest that it is canon --DuelMaster93 (talk) 14:05, December 19, 2012 (UTC)

About the plotholes, the only real plothole I read of is Brook's first fight (about which, should I remind that Brook fought a giant fly and some ants in Strong World?), the others aren't plotholes since they don't make any contradiction. Why didn't Sengoku mentioned that Shiki was beaten? Why should he have? This are what if situations, it's like saying why Pell didn't die in the explosion... he didn't, end of the story. Hence since there where a lot of reasons to consider Strong World canon, I don't understand this sudden change of thoughts about it. I understand instead why sff9 doesn't consider it canon, to rely only on sure-facts, but the thing is, that creates more problems then what it solves, like having a canon character but not the movie about him. leviathan_89 14:49, 19 December, 2012 (UTC)

The big plothole that makes SW's canon status questionable is Luffy defeating Shiki, somebody that rivaled Roger himself and that was on the same level as the admirals when Pre-Skip Luffy barelly budged a Pacifista. Even Post-skip Luffy didn't reach this level yet while in the film you have him destroying an even bigger island than Marineford. Most fans tend to agree that Chapter 0 and Shiki are canon, that however put his 20 years plan in a difficult place but a lot could have happened during 20 years.

In the end there are too many contradiction for Strong World to be canon so many fans have different views, i remember one saying that he considers the plot canon but likes to think that in canon the admirals took the Straw Hat's place in taking Shiki down. There are many ways to view Strong World but every conclusion leads to canon problems Adriano1995 (talk) 00:37, December 26, 2012 (UTC)

The point here is that Oda himself said this film is canon. It's pretty the reverse thing happened with Z, where Oda himself sayd it's NON-canon. However Shiki's defeat being a plothole is a non-sense. If you Shiki, you can see his abnormous power came from his devil fruit. and probably due of that he's been able to rivaled with Roger and fight with Garp and Sengoku. However no one said so far he's to Roger/Garp/Sengoku's level. The same Newgate said "I'll make you fly out of my ship" and we know newgate isn't more stronger than Roger. The physical strenght of Shiki is just a bit more than Luffy's one, being able to stop Sanji's kick with a hand, but being hurted by Gear 2nd attacks and defeated by Gear 3rd. Rayleigh92 (talk) 00:44, December 26, 2012 (UTC)

Oda never said SW was canon Rayleigh. He said it was Luffy's last adventure as a 17 year old (in both Manga and Anime), because the timeskip was approaching.   Galaxy 9000   00:47, December 26, 2012 (UTC)

Nope, Oda never really said SW was canon, and he didn't say anything about Film Z yet either, that one's probably going to be non-canon too even though it was announced that the guy who cut off Z's arm joined the Shichibukai one year ago. As for SW, the characters remembered Shiki as having rivaled Roger so he was in their level and to have caused such havoc in marineford before then he was in least as strong as an admiral, Luffy wasn't in that level, Shiki fought with the best of his era, so he was top-tier, Luffy's not in that level Adriano1995 (talk) 01:12, December 26, 2012 (UTC)

That quote isn't enough to make this film canon, Galaxy? If Oda said it's the "last adventure in both Manga and anime", then it's a part of manga story, it isn't? Rayleigh92 (talk) 11:47, January 14, 2013 (UTC)

Of course it's canon. Not only there was an actual manga chapter tying it with the main story, now it even has it's own LOG book. Strong World is receiving a pretty exclusive treatment if we compare it with all other films, and the reason it's because its story is actually part of the official OP-verse. SummerinGanymede (talk) 06:41, January 14, 2013 (UTC)

Actually I'll admit that there is nothing that really proves that Strong World (as movie) is canon, the best thing would be a reference to the movie's events in the manga, but there isn't. The sure thing is that Shiki and the whole prequel (chapter 0) is indeed canon and since the movie's events fits into the manga I believe the movie is canon simply by extension... there would be actually more inconsistencies if we wouldn't consider it as such. leviathan_89 12:19, 14 January, 2013 (UTC)

By the way, I believe the best reference to the movie's events (although it's still not enough) would be the Daft Green question in SBS Volume 61. leviathan_89 12:22, 14 January, 2013 (UTC)

Actually I believe SW is canon not because it was written by Oda but it is actually having volume 0 and it's own Log Book. Someone changed edited it in this wiki and made it non-canon even if Oda said it is canon (he said something that means it is canon). Brain.Y.Z (talk) 15:43, April 13, 2013 (UTC)

No, he didn't. Please read the entire conversation, and try to add new elements, otherwise the discussion would lead nowhere. sff9 _{18:33, April 13, 2013}

I realize this discussion has been closed for a bit, but there's something that was pointed out but wasn't discussed on. "And as far as something that will hold true for both the comic and the anime..." What are we doing with that? "Something that will hold true to both". If I'm not mistaken, doesn't "canon" mean "true to the story"? This wasn't fully discussed. uknownada ^Talk 15:49, April 26, 2013 (UTC)

I agree.  Staw-Hat Luffy  Talk  18:56, April 26, 2013 (UTC)

This got buried, so I'm bumping it again. Can we please talk about this quote? Not the "adventure" part, the "true" part. uknownada ^Talk 05:07, May 1, 2013 (UTC)

You're thinking too literally. It is true that it is Luffy's last adventure in both the anime and manga. The "true" refers to that, so why wouldn't that part matter? I'm sure it was stated above also that this was a foreshadowing of the timeskip.   Galaxy 9000   05:11, May 1, 2013 (UTC)

If it holds true to both the anime and the manga, then it's true to both the anime and the manga. Nobody actually established on that quote above. "Foreshadowing" does not mean "true", it means something of an indication; a warning. He literally said this holds true to both anime and the manga. True, manga, this. Those are the three keywords. uknownada ^Talk 05:20, May 1, 2013 (UTC)

Once again... You're reading half of the quote. "This holds true to both the manga and anime, that this will be Luffy's last adventure as a 17 year old." It was foreshadowing the time skip, and nothing more. We discussed this above.   Galaxy 9000   05:32, May 1, 2013 (UTC)

This holds true. This is Luffy's last adventure as a 17 year old. The fact that he's saying "this is" shows that he's giving acknowledgement to its story, and the fact that it "holds true" to the manga plugs it in. No, this was not discussed above. It was foreshadowing, but by the way it was worded it also makes it canon. I'm not saying it's not foreshadowing. But if something holds true to something, then it holds true to it. This holds true to the manga. If it's nothing more than foreshadowing, then it doesn't hold true. The way you're interpreting it makes Oda contradict himself. uknownada ^Talk 05:36, May 1, 2013 (UTC)

Re-reading the discussion, it seems we still classify this as non-canon...despite the fact that it doesn't look like that's what was decided on. The status should currently hold it as "unconfirmed". That doesn't mean "non-canon", just that it's not confirmed. And Galaxy, you still haven't answered how something holding true means that it doesn't. uknownada ^Talk 05:08, May 15, 2013 (UTC)

It's been over a month. Even if this can't be treated as canon, can you please answer my question of how something that holds true means it isn't canon. The literal definition of "canon" is "holding true". uknownada ^Talk 21:46, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

It's already been answered many times in the discussion above.   Galaxy 9000   21:52, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

I've seen the question only answered as "it's simply foreshadowing", but I don't see why that makes it non-canon. It was the reason why we had it canon beforehand, plus Oda's involvement in the film. Oda is saying Strong World is Luffy's last adventure in the manga. Strong World is part of the manga. If it wasn't, it wouldn't hold true. I only see the question answered on the "adventure" part, but the "holds true" part seems pretty much untouched in this discussion. uknownada ^Talk 21:58, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

Something Sff said above that addressed it (and I interpret it the same way).

this. Also Levi said something along the lines of "I wouldn't take it literally". I didn't want to repeat what has been said already, so those are examples of what I would've said.   Galaxy 9000   22:03, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

I was looking at Sff9's post as I typed that, and I still don't see how foreshadowing means it isn't canon. Plus, there was an error in that post: "Oda was saying that in both the current storylines at the time, Marineford and SW, Luffy was living his last adventure as a 17-year-old." That implies Oda is talking about two adventures: One in the manga, and one in the anime, both being his final. But Oda didn't say anything about that. He's talking about the film alone, and said it stays true to the comic. Also, Marineford being Luffy's final adventure in the manga contradicts SW being the final adventure in the anime. Because if Marineford is an adventure in the manga, then it had to be an adventure in the anime. As for not "taking it literally", why not? Do we have to discuss what Oda meant? Why not just take his word? Strong World holds true to the manga. That's what he said, that's what he meant, so why is it still being debated? uknownada ^Talk 22:11, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

"Oda is saying Strong World is Luffy's last adventure in the manga." Really? I would love to see where Oda did a Strong World arc. SeaTerror (talk) 22:19, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

No no, there's not an error there. Marineford was the current arc in the manga, and the anime was currently in Impel Down. The movie released months before the timeskip, and Marineford and the Post-War arcs weren't adventures. Impel Down had already started in the anime, so Strong World would be the last adventure in anime form.

The reason we can't take his word is because people can twist the words any way they want (foreshadowing, canonicity, etc), which means there's never a 100% canon verdict. Interpreting such a statement leads to opinions, while us saying that stuff that's actually in the manga is canon can be proven right away by it being in the manga. We are interpreting words instead of having a 100% factual answer.   Galaxy 9000   22:20, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

Interpreting statements literally wouldn't lead to debate. If we took Oda's word for what it is, we have a 100% factual answer. If we change his word or try to see it in any other way, that leads to conflicting opinions and answers. The way we seem to be interpreting it makes Oda conflict even himself. When we make the author contradict themselves, there's a problem. uknownada ^Talk 22:23, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

But there are multiple ways to take Oda's words. People could see it as foreshadowing the time skip, some people could take it as a canon statement, some people could turn it into him saying something completely different. We aren't changing his words, it's just the way it's interpreted by different individuals. Like said many times before, there's no 100% interpretation, because of how it can be looked at.

The plot holes that exist lead many to interpret it differently, aka as a non-canon.   Galaxy 9000   22:27, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

Plot holes in that movie can be explained, and plot holes exist in the manga anyways. That quote can only be interpreted in different ways if we don't take it literally. If we took it word-for-word, there's only one possible way to interpret it. You can't honestly say "This film holds true to the comic" can be taken in anyway other than "This film holds true to the comic" if you don't take it word-for-word. Saying it's not canon is saying it doesn't stay true. Saying this is not canon IS changing his words. uknownada ^Talk 22:31, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

Except I already said that that can be interpreted as saying that Strong World will be Luffy's last adventure, since Marineford and the Post-War arc aren't adventures,and that Strong World will be the last adventure, in the anime and manga real life timeline, therefore foreshadowing the timeskip.

It's just not safe to interpret it any way with 100% assurity, and should just be left alone until Oda outright states it somewhere. Just remember what Oda said in the Film Z pamphlet "I do not want those who read the manga, but don't watch the movies, to become confused".   Galaxy 9000   22:34, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

But leaving it alone causes a large hole in the plot, as the ties of Chapter 0 wouldn't exist. If this film isn't canon, Chapter 0 can't be canon either. You say Strong World is Luffy's last adventure in the anime and manga if we take it literally. If Strong World is Luffy's last adventure in the manga, then that makes it part of the manga storyline, confirming its canoncity. As for Oda's quote in the Film Z pamphlet, did he say that exclusively regarding Film Z itself? Because if not, it contradicts his previous statement with Strong World by saying it holds true. uknownada ^Talk 22:40, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

Chapter 0 can be canon, due to it actually being a chapter. For all we know, Shiki is still out there, his plan failed, or whatever. Think of it like this: Oda decided to have Shiki start his plan. In the canon, something happened to it, or it just never happened, but for his "non-canon" movie, he decided to write Luffy in in order to stop it. A "what if" story of sorts. Of course, this is speculation, but it's the only thing that covers the end. All we know is "Shiki started his plan", and that's it for canon matters. Strong World is Luffy's last adventure in the real-life timeline. The manga real world timeline, and the anime real world timeline, foreshadowing the timeskip. Rereading the pamphlet comment, it seems it was only directed towards Z, but really, why wouldn't the same apply here? Those are at least definite words about how he feels about movie vs. manga. Like I said, multiple interpretations calls for playing it safe, and waiting until it's said with 100% assurity.   Galaxy 9000   22:46, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

Determining a canon status due to it being manga is too narrow, especially in cases where Oda wrote that very chapter for this "what if" scenario. Oda gave us a story, and he gave it a tie-in. He gave us a manga chapter that was never a manga chapter. What if Oda decided to drop the manga and write the rest of the series for the anime? Does that mean the story just ends? Oda is simply continuing his story in a movie. He wrote it, produced it, and connected it with the manga. Chapter 0 is the manga's connection with Strong World. If Strong World isn't canon, that leaves a big hole that we can't fill. We can safely come to one conclusion about what happened with Shiki: He was stopped by Luffy. Who wrote this conclusion? The man who wrote the whole series. We don't say EVERYTHING in the manga is canon, like color spreads or crossovers. Being the manga isn't what makes it canon: The author's story makes it canon. Strong World is Oda's story. One Piece is Oda's story. If we disconnect them, the story has a major hole in it. Oda's intentions was NOT to have a giant hole in his story. If he didn't want this connected, why would he personally write it? uknownada ^Talk 22:57, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

I'm still waiting for you to post the Strong World manga arc. You're making crap up by claiming that Oda put it in the manga. SeaTerror (talk) 22:59, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

Chapter 0. There's the movie's tie-in with the manga. uknownada ^Talk 23:02, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

Because they asked him to write it for the 10th anniversary?

You're right about him continuing the story in the movie, but it can be seen as a "what if Luffy encountered Shiki" at this point. Oda left it off there in Chapter 0, so that it would act a prologue to the movie, but it doesn't really mean that Luffy was the one who actually stopped him. If you look at it as "Shiki ran into an obstacle during the 20 years, it still makes sense, or Shiki fell by the hands of somebody else". Disconnecting the two doesn't create any holes at all, since, like I said before, it's just Oda adding a "what if" scenario after Chapter 0. There's more plot holes leaving the movie IN the plotline. Oda wrote a non-canon story for the 10th anniversary of his manga, and that's really all it is. We say what's definitely canon in the manga is canon, like the SBS, the actual chapters with content. You're right though, his intention wasn't to leave a giant hole in the story, it was to write a story about "what if" Luffy stopped Shiki, and if you take it out, it doesn't really effect anything. It's never referenced in the manga. Shiki had a plan, and it either never happened, or was stopped by somebody else.   Galaxy 9000   23:06, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

Yep. You got nothing. Still waiting for you to show the Strong World arc. Chapter 0 is the only canon thing. SeaTerror (talk) 23:07, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

Chapter 0 cannot exist without Strong World. Strong World cannot exist without Chapter 0. Chapter 0 was made FOR Strong World. It was made by Oda to put into his storyline. Leaving Strong World out but Chapter 0 in means we are forced to speculate, and not just use Oda's story. Oda wrote a story. Why should we exclude it just because it's a movie? It's still a story written by him. It's still a story with the same characters. What plot-holes are created with excluding it? Zoro's injury? That wasn't even implemented until half-way through the arc anyways. Brook's statement? Even characters can make mistakes. To be completely safe, if we're going to call this non-canon, Chapter 0 has to be non-canon to. He wrote it for the 10th anniversary. He wrote it for the movie. Both stories have to be together. Leave this off, we'll have to leave that off too. The hole that's created by excluding the film but including the chapter is Shiki's waiting. You want to exclude this story just because it's a movie. It's Oda's story. It's Oda's characters. You can put it in the story harmlessly. He said it's true to the comic. Honestly, how can you interpret "it's true to the comic" in any way other than "it's true to the comic"? uknownada ^Talk 23:18, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

Oda never once said it was true to the manga. Anyway poll it just so we can get this stupid crap over it. SeaTerror (talk) 23:20, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

"And as far as something that will hold true for both the comic and the anime, this will be Luffy's last adventure as a 17 year-old." He said it's true right there. uknownada ^Talk 23:21, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

This statement is ambiguous, at the very least. And your analysis relies too much on the specific words he used, whereas it's only a translation… Anyway, the statement was only a foreshadowing to the timeskip, it has nothing to do with canonicity. Granted, it doesn't imply the movie's not canon; but it doesn't imply it's canon either. Therefore we have no proof. sff9 _{19:43, June 22, 2013}

Canonicity Discussion Summary

Pro canon:
1. Oda stated so in Strong World/Eichiro Oda Artbook (Con: It doesn't explicitly state the canonicity of the movie)

• Shiki is mentioned in Chapter 530
• Shiki from the movie is the same as the one stated in the manga
• Shiki's plan is briefly discussed in Chapter 0 which is canon

2. Ignoring the relationship of canonicity between above points and the movie itself will create assumption of Shiki still flying on the sky, which is rather ridiculous

3. It fits on the manga between Thriller Bark Arc and Sabaody Archipelago Arc

4. There is a relationship between the movie and manga in regard to the existence of a certain tree (Con: Even if some elements of the movie are present on the manga, it doesn't necessarily justify the canonicity of the movie itself, just like character Shiki's case)

Pro non-cannon:
1. Zoro should've been badly injured during his fight with Indigo as his wounds reopened when he fought Pacifista and Kuma (Con: The former can be assumed to be not much of a challenge compared to the latter)

2. Luffy doesn't wear the glass armband in the movie while he's seen to always wear it ever since leaving Thriller Bark until he gave it to Buggy in Impel Down (Con: Luffy could've simply left it on Sunny)

3. Brook states in Chapter 493 that his fight with Flying Fish Riders is his first battle as one of Straw Hat Pirates, while Brook also fought in the movie which takes place before the battle with Flying Fish Riders

4. Oda's statement regarding the movie contradicts the manga as Luffy's adventure in the movie is not his last adventure as a 17 year-old (Con: The word 'adventure' there may refer to the last saga in which the movie fits in)

Chaozmaster ^HighFive! _{10:44, April 14, 2013 (UTC)}

A couple of things to refute your pro canon points.

Why say Oda stated so if he didn't? Momonga is the same as the one mentioned and shown in canon arcs, and yet, he was featured in Z, and a filler arc related to the movie. The end of Chapter 0 was obviously just a little "teaser" tie in to the movie, but looking at it literally, yes, he is still waiting. Can't really say it fits when you mentioned in the pro non-canon section a few inconsistencies that would not allow it to be there.

  Galaxy 9000   05:14, May 1, 2013 (UTC)

All I did was summarizing all the arguments going around in this discussion. Although some of them might not be true, believe it or not some people are still insisting on using it as a 'proof' i.e. Oda's statement; BUT I also did put the counter argument next to it i.e. 'It doesn't explicitly say so'. You can consider the 'Con' argument as a stand to make the 'Pro' point to be 'invalid', as I initially planned to use that word but changed it to 'Con' to leave it open to further discussion.

I'm just trying to be fair and objective in discussing this issue.

Chaozmaster ^HighFive! _{12:12, May 15, 2013 (UTC)}

Necessity of adding movie plotlines to character articles?

I don't know where else to start this discussion so I'll start it here. Is it really necessary to list what characters do in the One Piece films? It looks ugly in the articles imo and since this movie and strong world are non-canon storylines, what's the point of listing the events that transpire in certain articles? Sure you can add a tag that lists it as non-canon but I still think it ruins the momentum of the way the articles are put together. Take Aokiji for example, if Film Z is non-canon then he hasn't met up with Luffy after the timeskip yet. regardless of whether or not it says these events are non-canon, it's gonna look really strange when Aokiji actually DOES meet Luffy again in the manga, don't you think? Plus for Kizaru and Akainu their backgrounds haven't been revealed in the manga so saying, "They joined the Marines under the tutelage of Zephyr" it's going to look even stranger if the manga covers that, don't you think? I think we should leave the movie storylines out of the articles to avoid this risk. --M4ND0N (talk) 22:09, June 12, 2013 (UTC)

http://onepiece.wikia.com/wiki/Forum:Filler_History_Sections?t=20130607184558#Discussion_2  Staw-Hat Luffy  Talk  22:11, June 12, 2013 (UTC)

Databook Blue Deep, Luffy vs Shiki

In Japan and some EU countries this is old news but probably english speakers don't know about it. Back in 2012, databook Blue Deep come out and it contained informations about character's relationships (allies, enemies etc.). This is the section about Shiki, page 68, italian version:

We can see that "Ciurma di Cappello di Paglia" (Straw Hat Pirates) are listed as Shiki's enemies, same as Sengoku, while Roger and Newgate are his rivals. So, according to this databook, the battle between Luffy's crew and Shiki happened. Blue Deep also contained Chapter 0 at the end and an interview in which Oda briefly talked about his special involvement in the movie project. With this I wanted to give new food for thought for the discussion. Salvo.esse.85 (talk) 17:53, 18 June 2021 (UTC)

Personally I think that Shiki's section is hardly proof of anything; if it was the section for any other filler character, they'd probably have the Straw Hats as their enemy too.
Seeing from the reverse side, Shiki does appear in Sengoku's section; however, as this wiki thinks of Chapter 0 as canon, and Shiki vs Sengoku et al is established there, this is hardly proof of anything either.
Luffy's relationship chart has no mentions of Shiki; but then again, it has no enemies aside the Marine (which is listed as "pursuers" but anyway). Once more this is hardly proof of anything, because if we take the "no mention" as canon then Luffy has no enemies, which we know for a fact is not true.

The way things are currently, I think that the only way to have this wiki consider the movie canon is if a character mention something that happened there in the canon plotline. Which we know that'll never happen, it's been two years (for them...) since that and they have bigger problems now.

Last but not least, I want to say that this is the only "databook" to have a "filler" character included (which proves (?) Shiki isn't filler), but other books about the anime mention characters, plotlines etc as if they were super-duper canon. Besides, we had Green Databook stating Sabo was 100% dead and Vivre Card is full of revisions; ergo, databooks aren't perfect.

By the way, before you say that "Shiki being canon is proof of the movie being canon", then so Chopper's movie (the island of rare animals or whatever) and Zoro's movie (the sacred sword or something) would have to be too.

On a different topic, I want to quote something I found on Toei's website: "[...] What's more is that the original writer, Eichiro Oda, for the first time in the history of One Piece movies, has completely written the script for this one!! Also, by doing a powerful combo, which includes having the movie's original characters appear in the main story, a movie that became a commemorative tombstone to refurbish the One Piece movies' history was born!".

Now Toei itself also has many flaws, but they are saying not that "Shiki appears in the manga then in the movie", but rather, "Shiki appeared in the manga just because Oda wanted to link the movie's original story to the manga somehow"... Which is just like the filler story arcs within the anime to link with the movies... Jessica Ilha (talk) 18:05, 20 June 2021 (UTC)

One Piece Blue Deep wasn't promotional material for a movie though, it was a normal databook with only manga canon characters and events listed in it, this is why I think this page 68 is something remarkable. The relationship sections are simplified summaries, of course it's impossible to fit all connections between characters (the absent are implied). But what is shown is true, and never happened again with other movie only characters like Zephyr or Gild Tesoro in subsequent databooks/magazines. And the reason is simple, we know that Oda worked only on the Strong World's script, all movies before and after that were other people's ideas. So this special treatment is reserved only to the 10th movie, it had a prequel chapter, a mention in volume 55 sbs, many interviews about it and this recognition in a regular databook. Sometimes mangakas use other media to tell official stories (Naruto The Last by Kishimoto, Dragon Ball Battle of Gods by Toriyama to name a few), it is not something out of the ordinary. Moreover, Oda wrote the movie's ending in a clever way: Shiki falls already k.o. from the sky, Marines can't know what really happened up there. In this way there is no need to make quotes in the comic about those events. In my opinion there has always been a lot of resistance against the film for personal tastes, but many sources lead to think that Oda 100% recognizes this work of his as valid and not treated like all other movies. Even Ace's novels here have the canon status, despite being written by other people, instead a story of the original author is apparently more difficult to accept. Ps: about Sabo's destiny in One Piece Green, that databook certified the present narrative of that moment, and at that time was a correct information. There may be some minor oversight in the databooks (like birthdays and the like) but the page I showed would be too big a mistake not to be noticed by Oda or the other editors. Salvo.esse.85 (talk) 21:45, 21 June 2021 (UTC)

Funny how you're talking as if I'm anti-canon, eh? I'm just stating facts.

First, I never said "movie promotional material" (which the Chapter 0 started as, mind you). I was talking about One Piece Animation Logbook and One Piece Rainbow!, both "canon" material deriving from the anime, thus containing mentions to anime-only characters.

Second, Blue Deep is the second-to-last databook anyway; the latest is Vivre Card, which hasn't mentioned any "filler" character as of yet. Shiki isn't mentioned either, yet, but maybe he will since he's name-dropped in the manga.

Third, you're wrong about Shiki being the last "filler" character to be featured in a databook or magazine; Douglas Bullet, Ann and their Devil Fruits were featured in One Piece Magazine Vol. 7. Not a databook, yeah, but canon source. Was it promotional-oriented? Yeah, kinda, but it's a magazine, promoting One Piece related things is kinda its job anyway.

As I mentioned, Chapter 0 and Shiki's mention in the manga are not the case of "now this is canon guys", but "we're having this collab between the movie and me (Oda), so I'm linking the movie to the manga via name-dropping". Which can be used on both ways, yeah, it's a thin, thin line.

I also don't agree with Ace's novel being canon and the Loguetown one not, seeing that it even made it to the anime and all. But mind you, "being written by other people" does not mean not canon in Japan. Writing a manga and writing a novel are different things, and novel adaptations are more often than not written by people other than the original writer.

That said, I should mention that Japan does not bother with canon or fanon. I, for one, have never heard/read a Japanese saying anything about canonicity, to the point I have no idea how to convey that in Japanese. For Japan, there is "the original story in manga form" and "its animated adaptation", the latter ranging from TV to OVAs to movies and having its own continuity, be it in or out of conformity with the manga.

Also, people should remember that the movie was also a celebration for One Piece anime's 10th anniversary, thus receving a lot of "special treatment", of which "canonicity" isn't implied to be one due to the fact I stated before, Japan doesn't care. In the same vein, Stampede was the celebration of the anime's 20th anniversary, and even though Oda helped with the movie (not writing the script this time, though), he has clearly said that he only allowed that kind of plot to happen because it was a celebration movie. So Oda's involvement in celebrations are expected, and whether the outcome is of his liking is something he'll nod and smile even if he doesn't think so. Jessica Ilha (talk) 23:19, 21 June 2021 (UTC)

I'm stating facts too, no other film has ever had the same treatment as Strong World (and for obvious reasons, since it is Oda's own work compared to all other movies). Animation Logbook and One Piece Rainbow are anime related books, Blue Deep was a regular manga related volume instead, like Red, Blue, Yellow etc. And in these type of volumes, filler characters are sometimes referenced to promote certain products but never linked to canon events. Page 68 of Blue Deep links events of a movie in the grand scheme of the manga's story. This was the meaning of what I wrote before, I hope it is clearer now. And it is something that simply adds to the rest: last page of chapter 0 (called Strong World as the movie, not by chance), the sbs of volume 55, the interviews in which the high involvement in the project is explained in detail. An involvement that has never occurred at that level again, as of now, not even in Stampede despite that too was a celebration. "Being (the novels) written by other people does not mean not canon in Japan", I'm ok with that. However, I find very strange that this is not true for the original author, since it is true for those who are not. Other's stories can be canon, Oda's story nope because of reasons. Before I gave the example of Naruto the Last, is an anime product but is seen as canon by manga readers even if it is another type of media. Multimedia products are a thing, especially when the original author is involved. In fact in 2009 many people believed that SW was canonical, in this very page we can see all the discussion. Certainly there is room for any point of view on the subject, mine is that over time a really wrong prejudice has formed about it. Salvo.esse.85 (talk) 00:55, 22 June 2021 (UTC)

The Crystal Ship’s Log Information

Just wanted to share a twitter thread filled with a lot of sources about what we know about the original plot of Strong World back when it was The Crystal Ship’s Log. https://x.com/NamiOrigins/status/1626415810527780869 I think there's enough information (before it devolves into speculation) that it can get it's own dedicated section. SteelSkull4 (talk) 06:22, 2 March 2025 (UTC)