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Kozuki Clan/Mokomo Dukedom in Allies Section
Shouldn't we put the Kozuki clan in the ally section like it is on the Heart Pirates, instead of every single person individually. Seems counterintuitive. Ddog892 (talk) 23:01, March 10, 2016 (UTC)
I have to agree. If all the members work for the Kozuki Family (in this case, Momonosuke), then it can be shortened up to to the Kozuki Family. KingCannon (talk) 23:18, March 10, 2016 (UTC)
Well of course, we should do that.
Joekido (talk) 00:14, March 11, 2016 (UTC)
Individual characters seems like a no-no. But do we include the whole Mokomo Dukedom as a part of the "Kozuki Clan", or are they separate entities? JustSomeDude... Talk | 01:34, March 15, 2016 (UTC)
- Asking the correct question, JSD! We definitely shouldn't add individual characters, not when they're all part of the same organization. But exactly which organization they belong to is the question. I think going with the "Kozuki Clan" is the safer bet for now, so let's go with it. Jademing (talk) 03:05, March 17, 2016 (UTC)
On second thought, it's called the "Ninja-Mink-Pirate alliance", I think we should consider the minks separately. JustSomeDude... Talk | 11:39, March 18, 2016 (UTC)
That could be redundant considering that the Mink leaders are already retainers of the Kozuki Family.
One could argue that because the entire tribe is under Inuarashi and Nekomamushi, they're in a way subservient to the Kozuki Family despite not being retainers. Chapter 815 showed this well, with every mink kneeling down.
This is basic organization. The subordinate of the subordinate of the boss is still a subordinate of the boss. KingCannon (talk) 01:56, March 19, 2016 (UTC)
Yes, but the forces they represent are still vastly different. One is a family in one country, the other is the entire force of a country. They both get their names directly mentioned in the alliance by Luffy, I think they should be both represented separately in the gallery. Let the article explain why the alliance between them exists. JustSomeDude... Talk | 18:14, March 24, 2016 (UTC)
We probably shouldn't base our articles on the stupid names Luffy utters once in a while, though I still agree that both the 'dukedom' and Kozuki retainers should be counted as different entities. Just for simplicity's sake. Aurora[1] | Yes? 18:21, March 24, 2016 (UTC)
The alliance in the manga clearly views the Minks as separated from the Kozuki Family. "Ninja-Mink-Pirate" Alliance, hello? So we should view the Kozuki Family and the Minks as two entirely different entities. In that case, let them be represented separately in the gallery as JSD said. Jademing (talk) 18:24, March 24, 2016 (UTC)
It is now formatted correctly. JustSomeDude... Talk | 17:54, May 31, 2016 (UTC)
no Ichimi
Doesn't "Mugiwara no Ichimi" mean Straw Hat Crew and not Pirates? Does the Japanese need to be changed to match Straw Hat Pirates? Meshack (talk) 02:16, January 13, 2017 (UTC)
They are "Mugiwara no Ichimi". They have not been called "Mugiwara Kaizokudan" in the manga. --Klobis (talk) 02:00, February 17, 2017 (UTC)
So should we change the name to "Straw Hat Crew"? Meshack (talk) 12:56, February 17, 2017 (UTC)
Nah, it means basically the same thing and every official translation calls them the Straw Hat Pirates. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 16:57, February 17, 2017 (UTC)
I didn't know official translations influence the way this wiki works Meshack (talk) 02:33, February 21, 2017 (UTC)
They can help when we're considering a term that is pretty much the same as the one for every other pirate crew in the series.
Why are you being stubborn about this? Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 02:36, February 21, 2017 (UTC)
I was just asking but Klobis said they were never referred to as Mugiwara no Kaizokudan in the manga so why have the name of the page this? Meshack (talk) 02:54, February 21, 2017 (UTC)
That's odd, first few examples I checked in official translation had it as Straw Hat Crew (Chapter 796, Chapter 803, twice in Chapter 806, Chapter 846, Chapter 850). At the very least it's inconsistent. But it's also been romanized as 'Straw Hat Crew' in the Japanese character introduction pages of the volumes for 25 volumes now. 107.6.84.228 09:52, February 21, 2017 (UTC)
Yeah. In the Japanese version of the manga, the name of the group is romanized "Straw Hat Crew" Meshack (talk) 13:09, February 21, 2017 (UTC)
So... is the change going to be taken into consideration? Meshack (talk) 13:44, March 10, 2017 (UTC)
It's better to be consistent with every other pirate crew then make the exception here. We have more things on the wiki that aren't translated literally. Besides, the term has been used for soooo long, does it really matter? Aurora[1] | Yes? 16:41, March 10, 2017 (UTC)
Part 2
I still think the page should be Straw Hat Crew rather than Straw Hat Pirates. Oda writes the name as Straw Hat Crew so this page should be written that way like others Meshack (talk) 03:58, July 1, 2017 (UTC)
Dude, starting the same conversation without anything new happening isn't gonna get you anywhere Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 04:48, July 1, 2017 (UTC)
Agreed. This was discussed already. Unless you have something new to bring to the topic, it's not getting reopened any time soon.
It's recommended to throw away socks after a year 10:37, July 1, 2017 (UTC)
I'm bringing this up again because it bothers me that this wiki uses spellings by Oda but completely ignores the Straw Hat Crew spelling and chooses Straw Hat Pirates over it. Again, the Japanese for the two terms are different so I don't see why you guys aren't changing it to Straw Hat Crew Meshack (talk) 02:25, July 11, 2017 (UTC)
Where is it romanized as such? Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 02:30, July 11, 2017 (UTC)
Everywhere. Here's an example. It's in all of the volumes and even in the ONE PIECE magazine. Meshack (talk) 02:54, July 11, 2017 (UTC)
They have also been reffered to as Pirates. You can go on about that the CP9 image is older than the volume introduction page, but what we should be looking for is a compromise. Does the fact that they are always referred to as Straw Hat Crew be relevant against the naming system every other pirate crew has? Is there even a distinct difference between crew and pirates in figurative sense? My suggestion is to change the phrase in the introduction to "mainly referred to as the Straw Hat Crew" and leave it as Pirates. Aurora[1] | Yes? 08:50, July 14, 2017 (UTC)
Whenever "ichimi" has been used in the series so far, it has referred to pirates. We don't have any examples of the crew of, for example, a cruise ship being referred to/named as "ichimi". There's that understanding that though they might say "crew", they are talking about pirates. I see no problem with leaving the page name as it is. MizuakiYume (talk) 09:21, July 14, 2017 (UTC)
@AuroraOfDeath Horrible example unless you're also suggesting to change Straw Hat to Mugiwara. Ichimi can mean "crew," not pirates. Kaizoukudan can means "pirates" Meshack (talk) 03:57, August 12, 2017 (UTC)
I learnt it from the master of bringing up horrible examples: you. Now, do you refuse or not refuse that they have been referred to as both, since you never explained? I acknowledge that they have only been referred to as a crew, but the discussion doesn't end there, so please stop repeating that. My request is that you reply to the things brought upon the table by me and MizuakiYume. I know it's hard for you to consider counter-arguments, but please try. Thank you. Aurora[1] | Yes? 12:09, August 12, 2017 (UTC)
They are pirates but that doesn't change what I said. Meshack (talk) 20:09, August 12, 2017 (UTC)
For the sake of consistency, we're leaving it as pirates. Crew is simply a more casual term given the reader's familiarity with the group. Six of one, half a dozen of the other.DancePowderer Talk 20:41, August 13, 2017 (UTC)
Leave it as pirates User:Roranoa Drake II/Sig1 01:44, September 8, 2017 (UTC)
Leave as pirates and this discussion is over. Awaikage Talk 22:54, September 30, 2017 (UTC)
Part Three-general naming
After going through several covers for a different reason and saw that they are romanized as "Mugiwara Pirates" (File:Chapter 357.png, File:Chapter 377.png, File:Chapter 756.png, File:Chapter 872.png). Rhavkin (talk) 07:50, January 11, 2018 (UTC)
Jinbe
With chapter 863, Jinbe has left the Big Mom Pirates with intentions of joining the Straw Hats. Should he be considered an official member now because of how welcoming the Straw Hats are towards him? It hasn't been 100% outright stated but I think all things considered it's guaranteed. Ecylisis (talk) 15:07, April 20, 2017 (UTC)
- He specifically left the Big Mom Pirates because he was joining the Straw Hat Crew. He did leave but I don't think he's part of the crew yet Meshack (talk) 15:49, April 20, 2017 (UTC)
He's all ready to join now and intends to do so, but he did not join yet. Awaikage Talk 16:08, April 20, 2017 (UTC)
Lets just wait for a few more chapters coz who knows... Jinbe might die in the nexe chapter. Dinos The Aurora Of Life Spam me here! 16:1320 April2017 (UTC)
He Has Joined STRAWHATS he dies or not , he is now offiical memeber of Strawhats . so add him in the list 11:23, May 22, 2017 (UTC) VickyDluffy (talk)
I want to add that Luffy did ask Jinbe to join the crew back on fisherman island, so this is not one sided from just Jinbe wanting to join. It's a mutual thing from both the crew and Jinbe, so please do update. LlVIU (talk) 23:44, May 27, 2017 (UTC)
Vivi was asked and ponder whether or not to go. Wait until the end of the arc, shouldn't be long now. Rhavkin (talk) 23:50, May 27, 2017 (UTC)
No. Wait for full confirmation i.e. the end of the arc like Rhav said. Montblanc Noland :: Talk 04:01, May 28, 2017 (UTC)
With the latest chapter, it's looking much more like a confirmation that Jinbe can be considered as part of the crew no? He basically just fell perfectly into his role as a helmsman, a position the crew has always lacked, which has always been indicated to be a role Jine was meant to fulfil. Not to mention, he just saved the crew's lives while fulfiling that position. Woohoot (talk) 00:10, October 6, 2017 (UTC)
I agree, that we can count Jinbe as the helmsman of the Strawhats from here on. He is called like that when they escape Big Moms wave and he did not just announce it to Big Mom and Ruffy but also to his old crew, the Sun Pirates. Bobowm (talk) 17:56, November 25, 2017 (UTC)
Jinbe/straw hats
Shouldn't Jinbe be affiliated with the straw hat pirates ?Strawhat Idriss (talk) 01:27, June 12, 2017 (UTC)
Jimbe seems like he's going to join but I haven't read the magna lately so I don't know if it's official yet. It seems like he's going to at the end of the Whole Cake Island arc unless he gets killed Shadowneko (talk) 02:25, June 26, 2017 (UTC)
Why aren't the germa 66 or the vinsmoke family listed under ally for the straw hat pirates but the Germa 66 is listed under the firetank pirates To love this (talk) 02:13, August 11, 2017 (UTC)
Jinbe as a Member of the Straw Hat Pirates
Hey I think Jinbe shouldn't be consider a members of the Straw Hats just yet after He makes proper farewell to the Sun Pirates and to me He didn't properly join the crew because He stay behind to ensure his other crew survival until then I think we should wait until he properly consider as a member of the Straw Hat
Cdswalkthrough (talk) 16:34, April 13, 2018 (UTC)
Yes, definitely. Luffy told Jinbe he was his captain, meaning Jinbe joined the crew. 20:12, April 13, 2018 (UTC)
Sorry I forgot to add some thing on what I said But I don't think Jinbe is officially a member of the Straw Hat untill he appear in Wano and make proper farewell to his other crew and just because Luffy said he is now Jinbe captain doesn't mean He officially a member as Jinbe stay behind to ensure the survival of his old crew the Sun Pirates
Cdswalkthrough (talk) 07:40, April 14, 2018 (UTC)
Yes, Luffy saying Jinbe is a member officially makes him a member. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 13:55, April 14, 2018 (UTC)
Um did you not properly read on what I just said I said I don't think Jinbe is a Straw Hat members yet as he stay behind to ensure his old crew survival and Luffy saying that he is now Jinbe's captain isn't going to cut it Cdswalkthrough (talk) 15:35, April 14, 2018 (UTC)CdswalkthroughCdswalkthrough (talk) 15:35, April 14, 2018 (UTC)
He read what you said. He just disagrees, as do I. Jinbe is part of the crew. Montblanc Noland :: Talk 15:40, April 14, 2018 (UTC)
No Considering that Jinbe stayed behind to save his old crew doesn't make him officialy a member If Oda officially consider Jinbe a member or Jinbe arrived at Wano after saving his old crew and Jinbe properly ask Luffy to join his crew that is when He should be consider a official member Cdswalkthrough (talk) 15:48, April 14, 2018 (UTC)CdswalkthroughCdswalkthrough (talk) 15:48, April 14, 2018 (UTC)
Why demand those specific situations? Luffy stated that he is Jinbe's captain. This makes Jinbe a Straw Hat, regardless of his current situation. No way to say otherwise except completely making up requirements that Oda has never used as a standard. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 16:10, April 14, 2018 (UTC)
Because I feel he shouldn't be consider as a Straw Hat just yet and Luffy stating that he is now Jinbe's captain isn't enough to consider him a member until he resolve his current situation He shouldn't be consider as a Straw Hat Cdswalkthrough (talk) 17:37, April 14, 2018 (UTC)cdswalkthroughCdswalkthrough (talk) 17:37, April 14, 2018 (UTC)
There was a discution on Jinbe's talk page about him being a member since chapter 863, but it was decided to not consider him a member until Luffy said it, and now he did. We should this and future case of possible members on each character talk page so we'll have everything in the same place. 176.12.210.20 17:43, April 14, 2018 (UTC)
"Why demand those specific situations? Luffy stated that he is Jinbe's captain." Because anything can happen in between. SeaTerror (talk) 17:53, April 14, 2018 (UTC)
Jinbe joining another group (not gonna happen) or dying (even less likely) would not change the fact that to Luffy, he is a Straw Hat throughout everything that happens in between Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 19:35, April 14, 2018 (UTC)
Jinbe didn't stay behind simply to protect the Sun Pirates. He asks Luffy (a proof he considers Luffy his superior) to stay behind explaining he will protect the rear guard along with the Sun Pirates to make sure the Sunny will be able to flee the Queen Mama Chanter. He is trying to protect his old crew, but ultimately he is doing it, and that's the official reason he gives, to protect the Strawhats (and even if it was just to protect his old crew, it wouldn't mean anything. He is allowed to protect other people even if he is a Strawhat). As said above, nothing that happens will erase what we saw this chapter: Luffy stating he is Jinbe's captain and Jinbe treating Luffy as his captain by asking for his permission. The captain considers him a member of the crew and he considers himself a member of the crew, even if he dies one minute after that he will die as a member of the Strawhat Pirates. - Gorenja (talk) 03:44, April 15, 2018 (UTC)
There's no point spending all this time bickering when there's a color spread in a few days. Whether Jinbe's on it or not should provide a better answer at this point in time. 45.56.153.136 04:03, April 15, 2018 (UTC)
Profession
Jinbe was never stated to be the Straw Hat's official helmsman so its wrong to list it as the profession. SeaTerror (talk) 16:09, April 16, 2018 (UTC)
I agree with the listing. He acts as helmsman (at least he did while escaping Big Mom) and Nami said: "I've never seen a helmsman like that." (chapter 881) thus stating that it is his profession or at least his speciality and since the strawhats don't have one yet it is pretty safe to say Jinbe now holds the title. But I see your point as well, don't get me wrong. --Bobowm (talk) 16:25, April 16, 2018 (UTC)
Jinbe's main profession is clearly helmsmanship so I think it can stay. Stating he's the Straw Hats' official helmsman is another matter. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 16:45, April 16, 2018 (UTC)
It states he's the official helmsman in the table since that's for the actual crew jobs. SeaTerror (talk) 16:49, April 16, 2018 (UTC)
The word "official" isn't amywhere on the table. Rhavkin (talk) 17:00, April 16, 2018 (UTC)
"Professions and Capabilities" but if you want to add unofficial jobs you might as well First Mate under Zoro's profession. SeaTerror (talk) 17:03, April 16, 2018 (UTC)
That's speculation. Rhavkin (talk) 17:05, April 16, 2018 (UTC)
Thank you for agreeing then. SeaTerror (talk) 17:22, April 16, 2018 (UTC)
Zoro never acted as First Mate. Actually most of the times Nami takes on command when Ruffy is not there. Jinbe on the other hand actually acted as a helmsman, but I do see the point Kaido King of the Beasts makes, although I have to add, that other activities of strawhat members are listed as Professions as well, since it was never stated (at least not that I can recall) that Robin is the archeologist of the crew. Edit: Since SeaTerror wrote while I was still typing the edit was overwritten by mine, so I readded it. --Bobowm (talk) 17:22, April 16, 2018 (UTC)
I didn't agreed, I'm saing Zoro is a different case. Rhavkin (talk) 17:41, April 16, 2018 (UTC)
It's the same situation since it was never stated anywhere that he's the official helmsman of the Straw Hats. SeaTerror (talk) 03:55, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
He got the directions from Nami the confirmed navigator and sail the ship. He has skills in maneuvering a ship in various conditions. He is a helmsman and a member of the Straw Hats. The straw Hats each have a profession they specialize in, regardless of other abilities (Usopp's crafts or Franky's ukulele playing). You're just being your regular anal self. Jinbe is the Straw Hats helmsman until proven otherwise. Rhavkin (talk) 06:33, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
Every single member was actually called their job at one point. Jinbe wasn't. Unless you can find the chapter that doesn't exist where Luffy called him the Straw Hat Pirate's helmsman. SeaTerror (talk) 10:52, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
While I agree that they should be explicitly mentioned to be of that profession for the crew (just the same as Brook is the Musician instead of both Musician and Swordsman), I think we could include Jinbe's profession in there with a disclaimer pointing that it is implicit rather than explicit. We can make such judgements based on precedent: each member has a profession, that profession is sufficiently obvious, only that person can be representative of that profession. Unless we could try and find a reference for each moment when a crewmember was explicitly declared their profession, which would also be fair. リ チ ャ ー ド Strong Fist «ℑ» «ℜ» «✩» «☯» Mornin'! ™13:29/28/Apr/2018 (UTC)
It would be better to reference them all but that could work too. SeaTerror (talk) 18:58, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
Nami said that he is a good helmsman in Totto Land, hinting that this is his position in the crew. In the descriptions of characters in the manga volumes (and in the beginnings of some films like "Strong World" or "Gold") each protagonist is named for a position: Doctor, Archaeologist, Navigator, Sniper... In the future volumes in which Jinbe will appears as part of the band, he will surely be named "Helmsman". --Cdavymatias (talk) 22:18, May 2, 2018 (UTC)
Zeus
So zeus is consider a crew member rightTo love this (talk) 03:56, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
I don't actually see why Zeus should be; he wasn't considered one of the Big Mom Pirates, he was lumped in with the homies. He's a tool, and Nami indicates she's going to be using him that way.--Rrmcklin (talk) 04:35, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
Wait what that makes no since homies are considered members of big mama piratesTo love this (talk) 16:35, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
It is utterly, utterly ridiculous that any one would consider Zeus as an equal member to the others. He is viewed as nothing but a tool--not in any way, shape, or form is he viewed by the others as a friend/comrade/crewmember. Ddog892 (talk) 05:06, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
So by that way of thinking spandam elephant sword, lasso, the zombies of thriller bark all shoul not be co sider crew memebers of there orginaztionsTo love this (talk) 16:35, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
I think it's better to see him as an ally. Currently he is only a weapon, like the Franky Shogun. --Cdavymatias (talk) 10:38, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
But zeus is alive franky shogun is not To love this (talk) 16:35, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
Yeah, he should not be listed as a regular crewmember. Awaikage Talk 10:40, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
He should be he aliveTo love this (talk) 16:35, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
But the wiki counts Funkfreed and Lasso as members of their respective groups, and they're just living weapons too. And Stronger is just a beast of burden yet he's a member of his crew. And Hattori is just a pet. At the very least a new subheader should be made reading "subordinates" or "slaves" for Zeus to be added in since "allies" should be more for those who are tied to the crew but not directly subservient to them or with them 24/7, unlike Zeus who lives with them now and is basically Nami's slave, so they practically own him. --SpikeDragonLord (talk) 15:36, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
He should be consider a a crew memember To love this (talk) 16:35, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
I know the addition of a Straw Hat member is always a big thing and that wasn't the case for Zeus, but we do put guys like Stronger and Funkfreed alongside their groups so I don't see why not to do it with Zeus. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 16:38, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
Exactly, same for Lasso and Smiley who are also listed as members of their organizations. Zeus himself was just Big Mom's weapon and he even counted as a member of her crew. Like I said before, at the very least make a new subheader for subordinates or slaves instead of dumping him in allies. --SpikeDragonLord (talk) 16:43, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
We wait to see if in future manga volumes he appears among the crew in the character descriptions? --Cdavymatias (talk) 18:30, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
Unless he gets an actual number or anything stating he's a proper crew member, he belongs in another section. I don't care which one. Awaikage Talk 18:46, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
That sounds very fair. Maybe one that reads "slaves", "subordinates" or "servants" like some other crews have. --SpikeDragonLord (talk) 18:50, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
He should be under a weapon section. He is obviously not a member of the crew since Luffy never asked him to join like everybody else. SeaTerror (talk) 18:56, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
He's referred to as a "slave/servant". Not a weapon. So the subheader for Zeus should be servants or slaves. --SpikeDragonLord (talk) 19:12, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
He was only ever called that in comedic scenes. SeaTerror (talk) 19:31, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
Until Luffy has not been seen as his captain, as he did with Jinbe, he is not a member. Currently he accompanies Nami, but at any moment he can return with Linlin in a future story arc. Currently he is only a weapon in the clima tact, not a member of the crew. --Cdavymatias (talk) 19:43, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
It was not said in the comedic sense when Nami first captured him in his shrunken form and threatened his life. He clearly should be marked under servant rather than weapon. --SpikeDragonLord (talk) 20:49, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
Actually it was. SeaTerror (talk) 22:47, April 28, 2018 (UTC)
For the record, I don't think that Stronger or Funkfreed should be considered full-fledged members of any groups their respective owners belong to either. That's always struck me as strange.--Rrmcklin (talk) 03:16, April 29, 2018 (UTC)
Zeus is just like smiley frunkfreed stronger and lasso they are some one wea0ons or tools.but listed as crew.memebers so he should be considered the 11 memember and listed as it or.very least be consider lile the thousand sunny and merry is To love this (talk) 06:27, April 29, 2018 (UTC)
Official member like the others no. But maybe in the members' gallery template he could be in a section of "Subordinates". --Cdavymatias (talk) 10:50, April 29, 2018 (UTC)
I don't think he should even be under the allies section. I think that it would be better if he was listed under Nami's "Capabilities" section. Ddog892 (talk) 21:31, April 29, 2018 (UTC)
His allegiance lies with Nami rather than with the crew itself. I agree strongly that he should only be placed in Nami's capabilities section rather than within the crew members template. This may change as his relationship with the crew is further clarified. We don't necessarily add Kitsui to the crew's members even though it has quite the personality and is placed in Zoro's control. Most fittingly I believe is that we could create a special subsection for him such as "Subordinates", signifiying his lower standing in the crew hierarchy, while also acknowledging his sentience. リ チ ャ ー ド Strong Fist «ℑ» «ℜ» «✩» «☯» Mornin'! ™22:43/29/Apr/2018 (UTC)
Placing him between Nami's Capabilities might be the best option. After all, surely he does not have much function in history unless Nami summon him with his clima tact. --Cdavymatias (talk) 23:48, April 29, 2018 (UTC)
It is like for example in the manga/anime "Fairy Tail", in the Fairy Tail Guild, or more specifically in the group of protagonists (or Team Natsu), Lucy can summon the Celestial Spirits, but they are like her "weapons" or "attacks", and not members of the group. With Nami and Zeus, the same thing happens. --Cdavymatias (talk) 00:00, April 30, 2018 (UTC)
Ok why dont we uae the header used for doniquoxte pirates and big mama pirates listed zeus under othermembers To love this (talk) 02:10, April 30, 2018 (UTC)
Another example is that, although Big Mom always had Zeus by his side, or other characters like Mr. 4 to Lassoo, Lucci to Hattori, or Spandam to Funkfreed, they are present with their owners as members of the group. But now Zeus resides inside the tactile climate, so now it's like the genie that appears from Daifuku's belt. He only appears as an attack when he is summoned. --Cdavymatias (talk) 20:56, April 30, 2018 (UTC)
Weapons is the only heading it can go under. Then the rest can be added too. SeaTerror (talk) 21:34, April 30, 2018 (UTC)
Ya but zeus is senient weapon lkke lasso but he under allies but lasso is under members not fair amd shouldmt matter that zeus lives inside of nami climate tactTo love this (talk) 03:56, May 3, 2018 (UTC)
Then we ahould add a section listing all crew weapons/ vehicles like shark submarine the franky ahogum the tank and other ones amd zeus ahluld be under that sectionTo love this (talk) 03:56, May 3, 2018 (UTC)
I like the idea of "To Love this". Otherwise I say we better call him Affiliate. Bobowm (talk) 01:51, July 16, 2018 (UTC)
Why cant Sun pirates be listed as allys of on straw hat pirate page
On sun pirate page they are called allies/affliates but the sun lirates cant be listed as straw hat pirates allies why is that?To love this (talk) 00:00, May 18, 2018 (UTC)
Because no official alliance was ever formed between the two crews. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 17:04, June 23, 2018 (UTC) ok but why are straw hats listed as there allies on sun pirates page then ?To love this (talk) 18:10, September 1, 2018 (UTC)
table Position and ability
Hello, please make changes to the table Position and ability. Brook's style is a combination of classic fencing and iaido (Japanese martial art. Its meaning is instantaneous sword drawing from its sheath, and further applying a lightning parrying or attacking). And Soul Solid is his weapon. The authors here forgot to indicate in the table that he also has great endurance, cunning, tactical ingenuity. Zoro is not first mate - this has not been confirmed not in the manga nor Eiichiro One. So the position of first assistant is not yet occupied. Светлана Фёдорова (talk) 20:56, April 30, 2018 (UTC).
Can there be a sections listing each straw hat vehicle
To love this (talk) 02:07, June 20, 2018 (UTC)
Asking a question in the title isn't enough to offer a change to the page, you need to add an actual massage or reasoning. Personally, I don't see a point in doing that since there is a list on their navibox so adding a table (presumably) to list them will just over-crowd the page. Rhavkin (talk) 18:17, June 23, 2018 (UTC)
Jinbe as a Straw Hat
Jinbe didn't appear in the color page of 911 meaning Oda doesn't consider Jinbe a member of the Straw Hat Pirates just yet Cdswalkthrough (talk) 11:51, July 12, 2018 (UTC)
Not all color spreads has all the Straw Hats, and this might be the ones at Wano. Rhavkin (talk) 16:01, July 12, 2018 (UTC)
Luffy's word > a color spread. We also don't consider color spreads canon anyways. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 16:03, July 12, 2018 (UTC)
No it doesn't matter if the color spread is not Canon if Jinbe is a straw hat then he should be in color page but he isn't meaning Oda doesn't consider him as a official straw hat just yet plus all straw hat member up to date appear in every cover pageCdswalkthrough (talk) 18:13, July 12, 2018 (UTC)
Chapters 802, 809, 811, 821 and excluding special cases (874, 890) and those are just from recent years. Rhavkin (talk) 00:54, July 13, 2018 (UTC)
Still If Jinbe was a straw hat then he should be in the cover page with the straw hat Cdswalkthrough (talk) 01:58, July 13, 2018 (UTC)
That discussion should go in his talk page. Rhavkin (talk) 05:40, July 13, 2018 (UTC)
chapter 901, page 12, last panel: Luffy says to Jinbe: "I am your Captain now!" I think that says it all. --Bobowm (talk) 05:54, July 13, 2018 (UTC)
I agree with Kaido and Bobowm. Cds, if you don't have anything new to add besides your cover art point, this is a done deal. Montblanc Noland :: Talk 11:50, July 13, 2018 (UTC)
Then Oda should have add Jinbe in the cover page and every cover page so far involving all members of the Straw Hat Cdswalkthrough (talk) 13:40, July 13, 2018 (UTC)
Don't you dare telling Oda what to do and what not to :D :D :D And Cover pages are only important if they're stories. This one is just for fun (with maybe some foreshadowing); don't take it too serious and read the manga chapters themselves instead (which clearly state that Jinbe indeed has joined). Bobowm (talk) 14:40, July 13, 2018 (UTC)
I'm not telling him what to do I just feel that if Jinbe was a Straw Hat then Oda would naturally add Jinbe in cover page involving every straw hat members but he didn't add Jinbe meaning that he doesn't consider Jinbe as straw hat and meaning that Luffy saying that Jinbe is members of his crew doesn't count it should be official when he started officially travelling with the Straw Hat also you are a bit to narrow minded about this Cdswalkthrough (talk) 15:13, July 13, 2018 (UTC)
Funny that you write that i am narrow minded about this, while i think the same about you (To let a cover page change your mind almost seems fanatic to me, since this single non canon thing is your main evidence against all that is said within the actual story itself). But i don't want to insult anybody here, i think you have the right to not consider Jinbe a strawhat, but please accept that the better part of One Piece fans feel different about it. In my eyes (and those of millions of others) the story clearly considers him a member. Bobowm (talk) 05:27, July 14, 2018 (UTC)
Then Fan are narrow minded to not considering the facts and I'm sure I'm not the only one who believe that Jinbe isn't a official straw hat actually I never believe Jinbe was a official Straw Hat from the beginning after seeing the cover page I decide to bring the topic up again after the last time when talk about wheter Jinbe is now a Straw Hat and rather just use Luffy's declartion that Jinbe is now a member of the crew as proof it better to consider what Oda's thinks about this rather then just only the feeling of Fans and how the story goes Cdswalkthrough (talk) 13:22, July 14, 2018 (UTC)
Somehow my previous comment was deleted, never mind now. Cds, I also think Jinbe isn't a good fit for the crew, being very serious unlike the rest, and him being invited to the crew was different from the start nor was there a joining celebration. Basically, Oda has shown us again and again that Jinbe isn't part of the crew, and I wanted to bring that up as well, but I waited to Volume 90 releasing and seeing if Jinbe is listed with the rest of the crew in the characters page for proof. Until then, Jinbe is consider by the fans as part of the crew, and the fans are those who edits this site so all we can do is wait and see how much proof each side has. Rhavkin (talk) 13:48, July 14, 2018 (UTC)
Your "facts" are heavily based in opinion, and unless you are Oda or have actually talked to him, you have no idea what Oda thinks.
It has never been established that a character has to be in a color spread before they can be considered part of the crew. And even disregarding its relevancy, the color spread argument isn't 100% solid because in Chapter 874's spread, the top characters in the popularity poll outside of the Straw Hats (besides Luffy) were shown. Jinbe was a top placer, but was not on that spread.
To consider someone as part of the crew, we simply need to receive any kind of confirmation that they are. Luffy said that he is Jinbe's captain, and as captain, he has authority to make that statement. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 18:47, July 14, 2018 (UTC)
Oda didn't add Jinbe in the cover page involving all members of the Straw Hat and you have no idea what Oda think either He would naturally add Jinbe in the color spread if he was member of Straw Hat the cover page from chapter 874 is irrelevant and you being to narrow minded to accept it and it plenty solid enough and Luffy's statement that He is now Jinbe's captain isn't enough to consider him part of the crew as he stay behind to save his other crew the Sun Pirates from the Big Mom Pirates I mean every cover page involving all every straw hat up to date appear there and Jinbe should only be consider a members when he officially accompany the crew and you are being a bias on this Cdswalkthrough (talk) 22:27, July 14, 2018 (UTC)
Stop making a huge deal out of a cover art and there's no point speculating on the reasons why Jinbe wasn't included on said cover art. Jinbe acknowledged Luffy as his captain. End of story.Fliu (talk) 19:33, July 18, 2018 (UTC)
Then your just as narrow minded for believe there is no point at all Doesn't matter that Jinbe acknowledge Luffy as his Captain if doesn't He accompany him all the way to the end. PS don't bother replying if there no point in continuing Cdswalkthrough (talk) 23:11, July 18, 2018 (UTC)
Another Cover Page involved the Straw Hat with Jinbe not include at all it made me questioned if Jinbe is actually a official Straw Hat at all Cdswalkthrough (talk) 14:57, July 20, 2018 (UTC)
Well, whether he's a crew member or not might need to be redebated at a future date, but as of now, it might be best if it stays. However, I would like to ask a question. If Jibe ends up not sailing with the crew, would the wiki still count him as a crewmember. I know it is far to early to say on this, but the wiki should start thinking about this now. Also, the last time we saw Zoro, Usopp, Robin and Franky were well over two years ago; however, they've actually "officially sailed" with the crew. Who knows how long this arc will take? For example, if two years from now, Jinbe still hasn't met up, it might be necessary to put a symbol to indicate something on the template. I know it's very early to think about, but its a problem that might arise.Nightmare Pirates (talk) 05:15, July 21, 2018 (UTC)
This discussion thread could benefit from some objective facts. Putting to one side Zoro and Nami (as One Piece was a fledgling series without many color spreads, and crew members joined in quick succession):
Usopp officially joins in Chapter 41
- He does not appear in the Chapter 28 color spread
- He appears in the Chapter 52 color spread
Sanji officially joins in Chapter 68
- He does not appear in the Chapter 61 color spread
- He appears in the Chapter 70 color spread
Chopper officially joins in Chapter 152
- He does not appear in the Chapter 147 color spread
- He appears in the Chapter 152 and Chapter 156 color spreads (which do not contain the full crew). Chapter 198 is the first color spread he's in that contains the full crew.
Robin officially joins in Chapter 218
- She does not appear in the Chapter 213 color spread (full crew + Vivi)
- She appears in the Chapter 226 color spread (Chapter 221 and Chapter 226 together contain the full crew)
- She appears in the Chapter 241 color spread (full crew)
- She was not listed as part of the Straw Hats in the Volume 24 (which includes Chapter 218) introduction
- She was listed as part of the Straw Hats in the Volume 25 introduction
Franky officially joins in Chapter 439
- He does not appear in the Chapter 426 color spread
- He appears in the Chapter 439 color spread
- He was not listed as part of the Straw Hats in the Volume 45 (which includes Chapter 439) introduction
- He was listed as part of the Straw Hats in the Volume 46 introduction
Brook officially joins in Chapter 489
- He does not appear in the Chapter 483 color spread
- He appears in the Chapter 489 color spread
- He was not listed as part of the Straw Hats in the Volume 50 (which includes Chapter 489) introduction
- He was listed as part of the Straw Hats in the Volume 51 introduction
So there we have it. 100% correlation between official crew member + color spread. Compare that with the three color spreads we've received since with no Jinbe, and it's pretty clear that the 'official joining moment' is being saved for later, presumably for a full crew reunion on Wano. I added in the bit about volume introductions to show that if Jinbe is considered a Straw Hat this point, he should appear in the Volume 91 introduction. If we're lucky he'll appear in story and officially join before that comes out, but it will be relevant when establishing his 'official join date' later on. 45.56.153.220 08:45, July 21, 2018 (UTC)
lol https://twitter.com/SPManga1/status/1020694621452750849 74.190.24.139 18:51, July 21, 2018 (UTC)
Agreed Cdswalkthrough (talk) 12:46, July 23, 2018 (UTC)
Hey did anyone check the new volume yet to see if Jinbe is really a member of the Straw Hat or not Cdswalkthrough (talk) 20:20, September 6, 2018 (UTC)
The new volume wouldn't tell us that, since it contains the chapter where Luffy says he's Jinbe's captain. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 20:48, September 6, 2018 (UTC)
What Volume are you talking about Cdswalkthrough (talk) 04:44, September 9, 2018 (UTC)
Volume 90. It contains Chapter 901, which is our source for Jinbe being considered a Straw Hat. So the characters page would only reflect things that happened before that. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 04:59, September 9, 2018 (UTC)
Vivre Card
Vivre Card - One Piece Visual Dictionary confirmed that Jinbe has joined the Straw Hats. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 04:54, December 2, 2018 (UTC)
It also said Vivi is a former member, plus databook info rules. Rhavkin (talk) 07:46, December 2, 2018 (UTC)
It actually called her the 13th member which means nothing since 12 members don't exist. SeaTerror (talk) 07:59, December 2, 2018 (UTC)
- It doesn't say that anywhere. You might have been confused by 0013 being her card number, which is unrelated. The card actually says:
- Former "Straw Hat Crew"
- Straw Hat Crew jolly roger under affiliations at bottom right
- Ship: Formerly Going Merry
- Back side:
- かつて麦わらの一味と共に冒険の日々を過ごしたもう一人の仲間
- "Katsute "Mugiwara no Ichimi" to tomo ni bouken no hibi o sugoshita, "mou hitori no nakama".
- "Another companion" who once spent her days adventuring with the "Straw Hat Crew".
- The card doesn't change anything we already know about her. She traveled with the crew, appeared in color spreads, they consider her to be comrade etc (without saying the forbidden word) and based on all that it's entirely consistent to call her a former member of the crew.
Jinbe being a Straw Hat is fine, it just doesn't given the answer of his official join date per above. This might be resolved once the opening pages for Volume 91 come out in the next day or two. 45.56.153.214 09:02, December 2, 2018 (UTC)
The Vivre card called her a former member, hence she should be included on the page and templates as a member with a {{status|former}}. Rhavkin (talk) 09:39, December 2, 2018 (UTC)
SBS Volume 76 states that Vivi is considered a comrade *without officially being part of the crew* Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 13:01, December 2, 2018 (UTC)
That was the reader's opinion / question, not a statement from Oda. And in any event it's correct; she's not a Straw Hat because she stopped traveling with them. 45.56.153.241 13:35, December 2, 2018 (UTC)
She was never a member in the first place. Databooks aren't done by Oda anyway. She was only a traveling companion who REFUSED to join when asked. SeaTerror (talk) 17:48, December 2, 2018 (UTC)
If "Oda's not involved in databooks" (which is wrong), you should take a stand against all new information obtained from it, like Marco / Jozu fruits, Blackbeard Pirates info, etc instead of being selective. Otherwise, see Forum:SeaTerror and learn to argue better. 45.56.153.238 09:30, December 3, 2018 (UTC)
Actually it isn't wrong. We add new information but we don't add information that contradicts already established information. Also talk pages are not meant for trolling. SeaTerror (talk) 09:33, December 3, 2018 (UTC)
Which part is trolling? And there's no contradiction. 45.56.153.246 13:33, December 3, 2018 (UTC)
Pretty obvious what the trolling is. The contradiction is that she refused to join so she was never a member. SeaTerror (talk) 19:20, December 3, 2018 (UTC)
No, she was asked whether she wanted to continue the journey or stay in Alabasta and choose to stay. Rhavkin (talk) 19:36, December 3, 2018 (UTC)
Questioning why you're not banned after you've kept doing what you said you would stop doing in your last ban forum isn't trolling. And Oda just released a pic of the Straw Hat Crew + Vivi / Jinbe for official One Piece Channel https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DtgIzFbW0AAGpc7.jpg 45.56.153.250 19:53, December 3, 2018 (UTC)
She stayed so she was never a member then. Also you're purposely spreading misinformation around about that forum so yes you are trolling. Also hiding around an IP range makes it even more obvious. SeaTerror (talk) 19:56, December 3, 2018 (UTC)
Based on what logic leaving a group meaning one was never a part of it? How is it even possible for her to leave if she wasn't part of the crew already? Rhavkin (talk) 20:06, December 3, 2018 (UTC)
She never left the group since she was only a traveling companion. If you go by your logic then every Galley-La Member is a Straw Hat. The databook contradicts what happened in the manga and since mangaka rarely ever work on databooks it means we should just mention it on her article at best under trivia. SeaTerror (talk) 20:09, December 3, 2018 (UTC)
Let's break that down:
- "She stayed so she was never a member then / She never left the group since she was only a traveling companion. " She stayed so she's a former member. And you still haven't identified any contradiction. An example of a contradiction might be "Gol D. Roger is a former member of the Straw Hat Pirates", which is contradictory because he died prior to the crew's formation.
- "Also you're purposely spreading misinformation around about that forum so yes you are trolling." False:
- "People say nothing about my actions have changed which isn't true. You can see from my edits that I don't even do those edits that I did to get banned in the first place anymore. If it's about behavior I have also changed that too. I'm not as bad as I once was which is also obvious from the edits that got me banned in the first place. SeaTerror (talk) 18:37, November 16, 2016 (UTC) "
- "I still like to point out again that after 6 ban forums over the course of more then 5 years we are still at square one with him. The only conclusion I can get from that is that his way of arguing is fundamentally incompatible with this community. People in the past were perma-banned for less and sooner then him. leviathan_89 11:22, 3 December, 2016 (UTC)"
- "See you all in 2018. It's recommended to throw away socks after a year 12:25, December 4, 2016 (UTC)"
- "And if he screws again next year, then we can ban him permanently. Until then... Yata Talk to me 21:46, December 4, 2016 (UTC)"
- "Also hiding around an IP range makes it even more obvious." Ad hominem. I've posted with an IP for years. You're the one who undid my edit twice without actually checking the manga, providing only the edit summary "A random IP changing information without providing proof."
- "If you go by your logic then every Galley-La Member is a Straw Hat." None of the Galley-La Members has been stated to be a former member of the crew.
- "The databook contradicts what happened in the manga and since mangaka rarely ever work on databooks it means we should just mention it on her article at best under trivia." Oda's involvement in the databook has been official documented. He doesn't write the cards but the information ultimately comes from him and he checks the cards. The special numbering of Vivi's card outside the ordinary sequence (0013 instead of ~0130), the clear and unambiguous statements of her being a former member and the Straw Hat Jolly Roger are all positive assertions that would not have been included if Oda didn't agree. If you want to assert to the contrary, it's up to you to provide convincing solid proof.
45.56.153.238 09:27, December 4, 2018 (UTC)
I see what you mean by the SBS. ST, you're going to have to provide specific evidence that Vivi has simply been identified as a traveling companion. It's been well-known for years now that she's had a special place in the crew compared to other traveling companions, even receiving her own Straw Hat number. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 15:10, December 4, 2018 (UTC)
The evidence is the x mark scene. She would have gone with them if she actually had been a member. She refused and stayed in Arabasta. A databook claiming she is actually a member contradicts what flat out happened in the manga. SeaTerror (talk) 18:27, December 4, 2018 (UTC)
Why? why does not going with them mean she was never a part of them? Rhavkin (talk) 18:37, December 4, 2018 (UTC)
Because she never actually joined. She rejected the actual invitation. SeaTerror (talk) 21:26, December 4, 2018 (UTC)
Where does it say that specifically? Which chapter?
The wiki rules dictate that we do not include Databook information that contradicts the manga, and now we have a Databook that says she is a former member and never was in explicitly said she wasn't.
Up until now it was never states that she was so with this new information and nothing against it, she should receive the same treatment as any former member of a group. Rhavkin (talk) 21:50, December 4, 2018 (UTC)
I don't really see the X mark scene as an invitation at all. It also could easily mean "you're one of us, and always will be".
As far as I'm concerned, SeaTerror is just basing his argument on an interpretation of his own, not a fact or anything. In this case, his interpretation is not more factual than mine's, so the only source stating any actual facts would be the Vivre Card databook.KingCannon (talk) 22:04, December 4, 2018 (UTC)
Alright, since this is an issue that's best not dragged out, I'm going to call majority and make the change. Kaido King of the Beasts (talk) 16:38, December 6, 2018 (UTC)
Why those the grand fleet have there on box ?
Yes yes i know luffy didnt offically accepted them but why can we not fuse there box with crew box and label theh affilates?need to speak to admin (talk) 23:08, December 8, 2018 (UTC)
The Monster Trio
Although in Archive 1 two Discussions were opened about it several years ago (1 • 2), I think it is appropriate to open this Discussion because, although previously in the Talk Page it has been commented that several members have said that nickname several times about Luffy, Zoro and Sanji, for the moment on the page there are no References about it. I at least do not remember recurring uses of that nickname, so I do not know if it's like that, or just a nickname that fans have popularized. And in case it was mentioned only once, I think that it would not be necessary to mention it in the page. cdavymatias (talk) 22:56, January 25, 2019 (UTC)
- The term "Monster Trio" per se, as far as I remember, is a term based from a mistranslation of a phrase mentioned by Nami and/or Usopp (if I remember correctly) during the Thriller Bark arc to reference Luffy, Zoro and Sanji in terms of brute force. Eventually, many fans popularized that term to refer to them and Oda once used the term in a color spread (correct me here if I'm wrong). It's not a story-level term, just a term for that certain situation in Thriller Bark arc. However, fans so loved the term that they hailed it even after timeskip. As for your suggestion, I don't mind about it being removed, especially with Jinbe's inclusion and Luffy's currently growing gap among the rest of the crew. "Be water my friend." - AnimeLoverPH (talk) 07:16, March 5, 2019 (UTC)
It was not a mistranslation. It was actually used by Nami which means it won't be removed because it's an official term. SeaTerror (talk) 17:33, March 10, 2019 (UTC)
- I re-read Chapter 455, Nami mentioned "three monsters" in the official translation. But anyway, I'll leave the "Monster Trio" to the consensus but change the source of the term. "Be water my friend." - AnimeLoverPH (talk) 06:34, March 11, 2019 (UTC)
Vivi
Should Vivi be removed from the crew member list? Technically she only traveled with them for a short period of time and not to mention she declined the offer to join the crew.--Anchorman34 (talk) 04:00, March 10, 2019 (UTC)
The databook said she was a member and contradicted the manga so they decided to add her to as a member. SeaTerror (talk) 17:25, March 10, 2019 (UTC)
Kuja Pirates, allies section?
Boa herself said that if he ever needs anything they (as in KP) will be there. (somewhere between eps 500 and 519) Kamo kuda (talk) 21:39, May 8, 2019 (UTC)